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TrueNoir

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Tank or Not

Hi im a new member of Gameamp but have enjoyed reading the guides and posts for a few days now.

I have a lv 20 controller and was now thinking of making a tank.
Originally i was going to make a Inv/SS or Fire/Fire tank because i heard that they were both ok at soloing. With the self rez of the fire tank and the defence of the other. I love working in teams but want to know im able to solo sometimes.
Then i read that they both suffer quite badly at the hands of psi damage. Im not sure about whether to switch to ice or stone because they seem more like a pure meatshield and less opportunities for solo, now im wondering if i should just quit a tank altogether and make a scrapper?

02/08/06 17:21

Captain_IcyHot

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RE: Tank or Not

If you are going to make a tank, I can say only one thing....

MAKE A STONE TANK!!!!!!!

The reason why is because when you hit lvl 32 you become awesome with Granite Armor.

GA gives you 50% damage resistance and 20% Defence - which is just plain awesome for BASE resistance. Add 3 damage resistance SOs and you are at 78% resistance - that's as tough as you're going to get.

Another great thing about stone tanks is that you don't HAVE to get a million other powers to make him how tough that he needs to be - which in turn takes away from all the fun attacks you could get.

My fire tank was super tough once, before he got hit with the nerfs. Now he's still tough, but sadly no tank can hold a candle to a granite tank in toughness.

I am no longer Captain Icy-Hot... I am Brimstone Titan!!!!!!!!

02/08/06 18:12

TrueNoir

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RE: Tank or Not

that sounds really cool but with your stone tank does he actually haveany offensive capabilities (i understand tanks arn't meant to be scrappers etc) or is he just an invincible meatshield?

Also with such good defence the chances are he'll get hit by a nerf soon right?

***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***

02/08/06 18:20

Sapphire_Gypsy

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RE: Tank or Not

ok my 2 cents... I've been you... well not you actually but been in your shoes. my Main is a troller and I love her but I decided to make a tank.

I made a SS/invuln... I LOVE her... I love her more than my troller. Do I think the Psy damage is that big a deal? not really... at lower lvls you don't encounter Psy that much (I can't say never cause I can't remember) and by the time that you get to the big time psy damage.... you know know to play your tank.

Stone tanks are nice, and they can do some nice damage, but I don't think that they have the defense that an invuln is gonna give you, and you don't get yourt big armor until later....

Puerto Rico did some nice math on the subject over at GH.... link here

and even made a nice calculator for them... see also here

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02/08/06 19:43

DieselJester

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RE: Tank or Not

I play a Invulnerablity/Super Strength Tank on Freedom and I like the nice balance that the two power sets gives you. You can hold aggro pretty good and take the damage to boot, esp if you load up on the Damage Resistances.

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02/08/06 20:04

Red_Scout

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RE: Tank or Not

I got a level 50 Invul/Fire Tanker, and I use to rock the box... I say use to because I screwed up his build trying to get the Medicine Pool into my build. I can still Tank on Invincible setting with ease, but my I do get dominated by Psy damage once in a while... I can't take on 2 bosses like I use to, but that will change once I fix his damn build.

Warning, my stories and blog is not meant for those who are easily offended. If you are one of them, then avoid the link, you wussies.

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02/08/06 21:51

TrueNoir

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RE: Tank or Not

Cool ithink im gonna make a inv/ss or inv/fire tank now, will that be ok against villians too? (im not bothered too much about pvp but if my team goes into the pvp zones i wanna no im gonna be alright)

Any tips you can give mefor a first time tank?

02/09/06 02:52

Red_Scout

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RE: Tank or Not

You want tips on PvP or just Tips on Tanking in general?

General Tips:

- Don't be afraid to lead the group into a fight. You're the first in and the last to leave the fights. Even if you have to bite the dust for your team.

- Get your Defense first, I've seen many new Tanks that don't have their defensive powers and just suck butt.

- If you have a great build going, you will never ever need Unstoppable. Its a suicide power when it wears off.

- If you're going to group a lot, get Taunt for the low levels. I soloed at lot in my lower levels so I never needed it, but I guess you'll need to a little bit more of crowd control since you don't have Invincible yet which has the Auto-Taunt.

That's all I can think of.

***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***

Warning, my stories and blog is not meant for those who are easily offended. If you are one of them, then avoid the link, you wussies.

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02/09/06 06:37

swissarmy68

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RE: Tank or Not

Tips? yes... Don't be afraid to tank. your main job is to take the aggro so they don't attack the squishies (Blasters, controllers). My best advice would be to find someone who is a good tanker and let them show you the basics.

When there is a good tanker on the team, I can be more relaxed about my troller and blaster shooting their AoE powers.

02/09/06 06:38

Glasher

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RE: Tank or Not

My first hero was also a controller. So I went toatlly opposite with my second hero. Went from being afraid of a strong breeze to being able to stop a Semi in its path. I have a invul/fire tank. I ABSOLUTELY LOVE IT !!!! He is now a level 50 and VERY tough. I have all of the invul. powers and the figting pool for my defenses. I have tried other combinations of tanks and I have to say I like the invul. powers the best. Stone armor is great, but I do not like how it slows you down and you lose some offensive weopons with Granite armor. (Stone armor still makes a GREAT tanker). As far as my attacks. I like fire. it does great damage and you do not have to worry about knockback like you do with SS or energy. When I taunt a mob on me, I dont want them to go anywhere. With fire you get two AOE attacks. One of the invul defenses has a taunt, one of my AOE attacks has taunt, and I have the taunt power. Needless to say, mobs stay on me and generally my team mates don't get any agro. My tank is also a BLAST in Sirens Call. It takes an average of 4 or more villains to take him down.(depending on the ATs attacking me). So, for my two cents, I would have to say an invul. tank is the best all around tank you can make. But it always going to depend on your play style and what you want your tank to be and do.

Glasher - Level 50 Ice/bubbles controller
Flaming Rage - level 50 Fire/Invul tanker
Realm Walker - Level 40 MA/SR scrapper
Greshan - Level 29 Peace Bringer
Greffarr - Level 24 Warshade

Lin-Ki - MA/Invul scrapper Level 28 Gameamp SG
Acrtic Hurricane - Ice/storm controller Level 21 Game SG

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02/09/06 07:48

TrueNoir

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RE: Tank or Not

Ive started on a Inv/Fire tank now;

i have resist physical damage, scorch, and dull pain. I was wondering with my next level-6 i should take temp invunerability or get fire sword, or even wait for combustion. I think with the Inv side i kinda know what im doing but havent had much experience with a secondary fire though like the idea of a few aoe's for when i have a lot of aggro.

Also for travel powers i was going to take flying and superspeed- mainly because of the haste but hear that teleport isuseful to a tank to get in the middle of a mob, what are your thoughts?

P.S i love this site everyone on here so far has been so helpful :)

***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***

02/09/06 08:43

Glasher

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RE: Tank or Not

QUOTE

If I remember correctly. This is what I had up to 6:

by level 2 : Resist physical damage, scorch and fire sword
Level 4 - temp invul
Levl 6 - Went with combat jumping for extra defense

I really can't remember all of the lower level powers I got in order. But, I did work on my defneses before my attack powers. It will pay off in the end.

02/09/06 09:14

Red_Scout

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RE: Tank or Not

QUOTE

Scorch is great. Get Temp Invulnerabilty, with RPD at a low level. My suggestions on travel powers, stick with just 1 travel power. Since you got the Fire secondary, you don't need Hasten at all your attacks should pop up quick enough with just 1 recharge redux in them. I use to have Teleport when Unyielding use to be Unyielding Stance and it wouldn't let you move when you had that power on. Fly is alright a bit slow for my taste now a days, but it has a great attack in it... Air Superiority. I loved that move, but when I respeced into SJ, I got rid of Air Superiority. I want Flight back just for that move alone.

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02/09/06 09:19

Glasher

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RE: Tank or Not

Forgot mention travel power.

I went with SJ. No need for two travel powers. SS is good but it kinda limits you on your travel ability. SJ is fast and you wont have to travel for blocks trying to get around high walls. And with combat jumping you will have another defense. Flight is a slow travel power and a tank really doesn't need to hover. You want to be on the ground and ready to move. With combat jumping you have your defense and you can still move at your normal speed. Flight is great in the PVP zones, but you can also buy a jet pack in there if you want to fly around.

02/09/06 09:31

TrueNoir

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RE: Tank or Not

With regards pool powers this is what im thinking;
Fitness- im taking this beacuse i see how important duration is.
Stealth- i understand this is quite cool but am not sure if it will suit a tank.
Flying- erm i like the idea of how peaceful it is being able to just 'float' high above atlas park
Jumping- i have this on my controller and honestly find it a bit boring
Teleport- looks really nice and might help me get in the middle of a group but am not sure
Speed- You've said previuosly i dont need hasten so i may drop superspeed now
Leadership- ive heard is good but not for tanks
Fighting- The fighting pool im totally lost some say itsgood some say its been nerfed too much now
Medicine- unsure for a tank
Provoke- no point ill get taunts either in taunt or from my fire secondary

Hmm im level 6 now i think ill take swift just because its the one pool i KNOW i want

***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***

02/09/06 12:41

BishopDon

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RE: Tank or Not

QUOTE

My tank, lvl 50 invul/ss, has SJ as a travel power. later on, i put in Hover and have it 3 slotted. Not as fast as fly but i now have mobility in caltrops/earthquake situations. SJ works great for tanks, to get in and out quickly, mix that with Hover and you just won't be denied or slowed.

IMO the fighting pool is useless with Invul. period, point blank. The medicine pool, again, is useless. Dull Pain takes care of that for you. No need for Provoke with the Invul as well, you are a walking aggro machine. what taunt doesn't pull, some of your defenses have built in taunt. you'll find this out when you hit 25+ and go back to Atlas and get attacked out of the blue by a lvl 1-2 Hellion. That is the funniest site to see...lol.

Haven't tried TP, but i've seen it. don't like it. for me and tanking, takes too long to kick in if you need to get away (most will disagree with me though).

Fitness pool is a must, seeing you'll be running some toggles and doing a lot of attacking, and yes, take swift. no need for hurdle if you get the SJ travel power. Oh, SJ by itself is good, 1 slotted but to get there quicker, you can 3 slot to max it's potential out.

One recommendation I'll make and it's been said before as well. GET YOUR DEFENSES AS EARLY AS POSSIBLE! The offense will come into it's own in the mid 20's and you can be an unstoppable force going into your 30's (I can solo all my missions set to invinsable and do damage like if not equal to a Scrapper). Unstoppable, you won't need it or I haven't used it and never had a need for it. That's your option.

I made my Invul/SS tank since I4 and i have yet to respec him for any of the new changes (I6 or ED). He works just as great as he did since day one. I've even received compliments from other tanks i've teamed with on his success without respec'ing. Only issues I run into is Psi from AVs. the rest of them, I can manage.

***Looking for new content***

02/09/06 13:04

TrueNoir

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RE: Tank or Not

hmm... ive been thinking long and hard about the power pools.

Ive already started the Fitness pool so thats up.
My controller has SJ and i really don't like it, i know it's really cool and i want to like it but dont, so im going to take fly, not as a travel power but more to do with the image of my tank and like the idea of just resting in the air.

This leaves me with the decision of what i WILL take as my actual travelling power. I need something that works weill whether that be SJ, SS or TP.

On anothernote thankyou forhelping me with my build hopefully when i get to lv 50 (ages away) i can show you all :)

02/09/06 14:33

Thundarpants

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RE: Tank or Not

I too have begun down the path of the Tanker. I've long been a Blaster, running 3 on Liberty, and several others spread around the servers. I went With Stone/Stone because of the animations. It looks like you've already chosen Invul/Fire, and that combo looks frikin Awesome. Invul is definately one of the toughest defense sets. A match for Stone with it's gives and takes, and the Fire secondary looks like it has a lot of AoE damage to improve your "Tauntability". Me, I love whacking things with the big hammer, and the Controllerish type attacks that also have some AoE effects(I love Fault!).

There are so many better tanks than I to offer you advise. But I'd just like to tell you how much fun you will have with this AT. Being squishy for sooooo long, I had my mind wrapped around the feel of the game. Now that my Stone Tank is 29 and advancing, I am having sooooo much fun!

With the 6 enemy limitation of Taunt now, Any AoE attack like Fire Breath and Fire Sword Circle will work like a Taunt. The nice thing is, that these attack powers have the Blaster AoE limitation on hits that I believe is 10-16. So, with that in mind, Taunt to the right, Fire Breath to the left and you have just taunted WAY more of the baddies! With the need to beef up your Defenses a priority at the lower levels. Save those all important attack powers for when the AOE's and Cone attacks start getting offered in the secondary. I'm finding that my AOE powers on my Stone Tank are making an excellent secondary Taunt feature to maintain more aggro.

Jump in the middle of the fight. Tick EVERYTHING off. Roast them till they drop. Trust me on this one. You'll have fun!

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02/09/06 16:42

BishopDon

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RE: Tank or Not

The one plus to the Invul set is, the defense powers give you more AoE tauntibility than the other tank sets :). So in a since, you are going to be the better aggro taker than the rest and with Fire for more AoE attacks, there will be nothing you can't aggro in any map.

Again, if you just want the Hover look and not really concerned about actually flying, just take Hover and 3 slot it (slower than fly, but can move as fast as sprint) and put the other choice elsewhere with the allotted slots. I'd say go for the SJ or TP self, but the others just don't fit a tank.

***Looking for new content***

02/10/06 07:03

DarkAudit

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RE: Tank or Not

Started a Fire/SS tank, and I think I made that cardinal mistake of going for offense first. Took jab, combat jumping and haymaker with the first power picks once out in the world. He's also an endurance hog when blazing aura, fire shield, and combat jumping are all active.

My last power pick was consume. It's a little better, but I'm still not sure I've done this guy quite right so far.

Super Jump is a given @ 14, but suggestions on what to get from 12-20?

Freedom

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Dr. Teamwipe - Lvl 11 Science/Defender Empathy/Energy
Pittsburgh Kid - Lvl 28 Magic/Tanker Fire/Super Strength
VegOMatic - Lvl 23 Natural/Scrapper Katana/Regeneration
Kelvinate - Lvl 25 Peacebringer
Ambushed Bug - Lvl 8 Warshade
Captain Marbles - Lvl 28 Magic/Brute SS/Inv
Dan Backslide - Lvl 7 Tech/Dom Mind/Psi

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Mr. Manners - Lvl 16 Natural/Controller Mind/Sonic Resonance

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King Coal - Lvl 12 Magic/Tanker Stone Armor/Super Strength
King Buckwheat - Lvl 18 Science/Defender Empath/Energy Proud Member of Veggie Medley
The Couch Burner - Lvl 6 Tech/Blaster Fire/Fire
Incarnate - Lvl 3 Magic/Brute Dark Melee/Dark Armor
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02/10/06 07:51

MightySmiter

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RE: Tank or Not

QUOTE

im not a tank,but rather a dark scrapper, but i do have some advice. dont just go rushing into a group and leave your team behind without checking first. i have been on many a team where the defender has to concentrate on the tank, so the rest of us suffer. while you may be at fukk health after a battle, the rest of us are prbly not because you held the aggro and got the heals. tanking is very good and helpful, but dont get reckless like a lot of em do

COH GUARDIAN
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-Member of Protectors of Paragon City
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-Member of The Golden Council

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02/10/06 09:24

Thundarpants

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RE: Tank or Not

QUOTE

I aggree with this to a point. The team should be following the Tank's lead. He may not be the "Leader" of the team. But if the only person that needs a heal is the Tank, then they doing their job. Of course be mindfull of people going AFK, but if they are all there, and the life and endurance bars are full, don't be afraid to control the pace of the mission.

I lead many teams in my SG, and most times my leadership consists of deciding left or right on the map, and telling everyone to follow the Tank's aggro lead. Now that I'm running a Tank more often myself, I actually feel the whole spectrum of leadership in missions and with my friends. He's right, don't be reckless, but this is the time for you to shine. Take point, and take control of the pace of the devastation. Your teammates will usually have no problems telling you to slow down if you are getting overly aggresive.

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02/10/06 11:07

MadMadJester

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RE: Tank or Not

I have a level 41 Fire/stone tank, and on the subject of travel powers SJ does have some benefits. Although as you say it can be a bit boring, you get there faster and "Acrobatics". Acrobatics is really nice, because can be hard to hold aggro if you spend the who fight on your back from knockdowns. I'm not sure, but think Nemesis can be some of the worst on knockdowns and acrobatics do a good job if your primary power does not have a deffense that incorporates it into it.

02/10/06 11:33

Thundarpants

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RE: Tank or Not

Super Jump is most definately one of the fastest and most efficient travel powers. The beauty of the Jumping pool is that it requires almost no slotting at all, so you can save those slots for defense and offense. With Unyeilding Stance though, you will not need Acrobatics. You are protected from Knockback with that. Now those of you that have chosen the Fire/??? path for your tanker, Acrobatics is almost a must, as none of the primary defenses offers tou resistance to KB.

I myself love using Rooted on my Stone Tank, but OMG I'm slow. Having a friend that plays Kinetics is my fav. Rooted with Speed Boost is the bomb! I know Unyeilding also slows you movement speed a bit as well, bu I don't think it's as bad as the Stone version.

I'm not sure what kind of KB protection you get in the Ice set.

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Don't hate Raza because she's beautiful......
Because she's not......

02/10/06 12:01

TrueNoir

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RE: Tank or Not

Yea im level 9 now (almost 10) and have unyielding stance so knockdowns isnt a prob as you said thought it drains energy so much but at 14 ill take stamina anyway so that shoulod help. Im also really liking combustion the aoe helps alot. Ive already take arial superority too, it suits my character design hes more of a superman style than a hulk style though im now considering taking teleport or Superspeed for the travelling since both are fast- i'll leave SJ on my controller for thetime being.

What do you guys think of the later tank inv abilites like resist elements/energies , invincibility and tough hide; should i take them all?

02/10/06 12:11

Glasher

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RE: Tank or Not

You should get all of the powers in the invul. pool. Unstoppable is one you can probably do without. But I have found it to be very useful. You only get the power for three minutes and then you will lose 98% of you health when it runs out so you have to be careful. But it is almost impossible for you to die. Psionics will still tear you up but all other damage is stopped. I have used it on several occasions. Sometimes for fun and other times out of necessity.

02/10/06 14:01

xXCRUSHERXx

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Tank

Ok I have read all the posts now and I agree with some and some not so much. I have 2 tanks both 50 and both have been mentioned here. First Juggunara is SS/Invul and she is tight. Good damage protection and with SuperStrength as the secondary you have the ability to have Rage (super build up) doubled. What I mean by this is that with hasten running I (for about 30 seconds) have 2 rages on. This is like getting 160% more damage for each attack that you use during the time when you have both rage buffs affecting you.

Also there is just no getting around the fact that an invul tank with Invincibility running will not lose agro. Sometimes to a very high damaging blaster but not very likely. Juggs is just nasty ask Thundar and I really do love running her.

Now with that being said Crusher is a Stone/WarMace. He does not die. Point blank when I go into Granite armor there just isn't anything that can or has killed him since I6 came out. I run him mostly in rock/tough/stone skin/rooted and the protection is good with the defense from rock and the resistence from SS and Tough. But when the fight gets to big I go right for the granite and with tough ... forget it. There is a minus to damage for having Granite (-30%) and a slight accuracy debuff but that is nothing comepared to the fact that you can not be killed.

On him I have Earth's Embrace (3recharge/ 3 health) which I hit when ever it comes up. This adds 1400 hp to your total and gives you some toxic resistence. With rooted on ( 4 slotted heals) you get a nice little heal recovery bonus to go with Health (1 slotted heal ) from the fitness pool. All my attacks are slotted with one end redux and all the toggles also. He is a true tank. To counteract the speed problem get swift and 4 slot it with run speed. You won't be fast but you will be managable in Rooted or in granite. Hope this helps.

CC

02/10/06 22:23

xXCRUSHERXx

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RE: Tank or Not

Bump ... want to check Sig.
CC

***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***

Liberty
Crusher Creel Level50 Stone Armor/War Mace Magic Tank
Juggunara Level50 Invulnerable/Super Strength Mutation Tank
Syrruss Level50 Warshade Science Squid/Dwarf
Bullz-Eye Level19 Assault Rifle/Ice Tech Blaster
MindzStorm Level 50 Illusion/Storm Magic Troller
Bladez Level 32 Claws/Invul Science Scrap
Hunter Spielman Level 12 Martial Arts/Invul Natural Scrap
Arachonos Destroyer (Villian) Level 8 Dark/Dark Mutation Brute
Magic Stalker
Evil Crusher (Villian) Level 9 Super Strength/Energy Armor Magic Brute
Percephone (villian) Level 6 Necromancy/Bubble Magic Mastermind
Darkened Mindz (Hero) Level 9 Dark Miasma/Psionic Magic Defender

02/10/06 23:24

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