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Nova302

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Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

I was excited bout the patron powers when i first heard bout them, so i tried em out on my stalker once i7 went live, and i was very disapointed at how only 1 of the 4 powers given actually helped, i mean why would a stalker use a range, a snipe, and a pet. Now dont get me wrong some stalkers find these powers useful, but the devs coulda done a bit better, like maybe another defense power, maybe even a heal woulda helped. And what fun is it where you have 4 patrons but no matter which one you go with you get the same type of powers just different animations, not much of a surprise there.

12/15/06 13:40

Mzzkc

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

I believe that out of the sets the Masterminds are actually getting the better deal. At 41 they can get their resistance power, which is actually very useful in longer battles in which aggro is unavoidable. And at 47 they can get a pretty nice hold (Soul Storm being the best simply because of the animation and the bugs it had in PvP (until just recently) ). The first cone power they get really isn't that great for anything except getting yourself killed, but the third available power differs for each Patron so that it really does make a difference in regards to what set you pick. But, in the end though, I agree with you when you say the villains really got left out in the cold when it came time to make the epic power sets. Just my 2 cents.

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12/15/06 14:02

BishopDon

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

QUOTE

You know, I'm in the middle with them. I wish they were a little more diverse and different as well. However, I really enjoy the Snipe and ranged attack...especially for Stalkers. Since I don't do PvP, where these would probably not be good, PvE, they are perfect for me. Heck, I even enjoy having that little pet around...great meat shield.

Picture this, large mobs with bosses/Lts...use the Snipe and ranged attack to weed the crowd (Snipe hitting for Critical while hidden), then you go in and clear the rest out..just like a Scraster would do :)

Yes, they could have offered a little more diversity to the sets like the Heroes have (body mastery, armor sets, fire, etc.) with each one offering something different and unique to the set.

Maybe in future Issues they'll work on that one.

12/15/06 14:11

Mzzkc

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

QUOTE

Scraster

I can honeslty say I have never heard that one used before EVAR. "Blapper" maybe, but not "Scraster". I would have given you some points for that, but it was not as cool a word as "pwndizzle" was. . . So. . .yeah. . .

Ontopicness: I share Bishops hope that Villains will eventually have a more diverse selection of epic powers. Maybe a system where you choose a patron and then each patron has their own sub-group sets that offer their own unique theme. Who knows. But, a little more to choose from would be nice.

***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***

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12/15/06 14:28

BishopDon

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

QUOTE

I can honeslty say I have never heard that one used before EVAR. "Blapper" maybe, but not "Scraster". I would have given you some points for that, but it was not as cool a word as "pwndizzle" was. . . So. . .yeah. . .

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12/15/06 14:41

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

What about a Contrapper... i have one of them.... anyway
i tend to agree the diversity of the heros patron powers is a godo thing aloows for more baleneced characters and powers. But i also think that some are decent.. i mean as a pvp stalker in my high 30's (first one to call me lowbie gets killed) i am looking foward to a hold.. nothing like holding a foe runing over placate build up AS.. thats just fun to think about.

And that is my cent and a half's worth

12/16/06 02:26

Sapir

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

I prefer Tankstermind!

That being said, I like the Patron Pools, but I wouldnt mind a little more diversity. To be honest with my Hero, I am not terribly impressed with the selection of APP's, but that is just me. I guess Tanks, and Scrappers get some good Pools, but my Blaster was just sort of 'bleah' for choices. It took me a good week of Testing to pick a Pool, and Im still not terribly impressed with it.

When you really look at the PPP's, they are exactly what they are meant to be and fairly diverse for that. They are Patron Signature Powers. So from a Storyline standpoint they are about as complete as possible if a little limited. I took all of my Patron's Powers just to mess with them and have just about decided which ones to drop, and which I cant live without. It will be the first Respec I have done on my MM.

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12/16/06 06:41

Nova302

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

QUOTE

When you really look at the PPP's, they are exactly what they are meant to be and fairly diverse for that. They are Patron Signature Powers. So from a Storyline standpoint they are about as complete as possible if a little limited. I took all of my Patron's Powers just to mess with them and have just about decided which ones to drop, and which I cant live without. It will be the first Respec I have done on my MM.

i understand they are meant to be based off the signature villains which is part of the storyline, i know,, but they could have still given us a better selection, they coulda even put recluse in with the bunch to make it more interesting, like i said i understand the concept they were going for, but they coulda changed it up a bit and made the powers a lil more different, like for example for ghost widow they coulda put a heal in there for the stalkers and/or brutes, i mean cause she is a dark toon so im sure she uses heals, same with Mu mastery, ive seen Mu's heal aswell, all im saying is they coulda just mixed it up a bit more, instead of making em all the same as the other.

***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***

Assassin Nova >> Lvl 50 [em] [ea] Stalker >> Guardian (Main) [Badge Hunter/Hero Slayer]
Sinister Surge >> Lvl 50 [em] [elec] Brute >> Guaridan
Just In Time >> Lvl 50 [fire] [cold] Corruptor >> Guaridan
Brain Power >> Lvl 50 [mind] [ea] Dominator >> Guaridan
Stealth Spider >> Lvl 27 [nwt] [wt] Night Widow >> Guardian
Jaws IronFist >> Lvl 24 [ss] [invuln] Brute >> Infinity

<< @Badgeman >>

12/16/06 08:28

Mohawk_Death

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

Well I can say this...the views here may have opened my eyes more to PPP then I was originally aware of. My MM just got the first PPP choice so I'm not really sure about the whole thing yet. As for the Heroes side,I haven't gotten far enough to find out but the insight here makes it sound interesting...I'm not saying it'll be just sounds good.My MM's PPP set is Mu Mastery,so if someone could shed more light on why this is good for a MM please let me know. I'd appreciate it.

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01/15/07 10:12

Nova302

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

Well, MM's got the best set of Patron Powers overall, they get 2 holds/immobs, a defense power, and a AoE, all of them are like that except for Mako, his set gives 3 AoE's and a defense power. So for Mu Mastery, depending on how your MM is built, i'd just get all but the AoE, unless you've built your MM do be able to help out the pets.

01/15/07 11:23

Wistoguild

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

All i know is that the heroes got a much sweeter deal. i have a 50 brute and didnt take any of the PPPs. they just werent good enough to put in my build. on the heroes side i got my troller to 50 and picked stone. you get a good resistance power, a knockback power and a self heal. there just isnt any comparison between heroes and villains. villains definately got shafted.

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01/15/07 12:55

Nova302

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

i got the hold for my brute and it is helpful in pvp to take down those fliers.

01/15/07 13:49

Redknight8

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

I was wonder what patron power is the best for a master mind? I was thinking the Mako one is but not sure.

01/15/07 16:09

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

Well RedKnight8, it matters what type of build you're going for.

For a solid PvP build, I would take nothing more than the armor, but if you're not a good Pvper, then either Scirroco or Ghost widow.

01/15/07 17:17

Redknight8

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

I don't like to PVP. I'm more like a PVE person.

01/15/07 17:53

VincentGX

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

I just got my primary hero to 50, a blaster, and I liked the munitions set just great. I have yet to get a villian that high, but there are some things that concern me.

1- you can only select one patron villian to take your sets from.
2 Once you select a patron, you have to do a series of missions to even select those new powers. In heros, you can select your epic at 41 without delay.
3 Once you select a patron and get these powers, you are stuck with them, and can not respec them out. In heros, the next time you respec, you can pick a whole new set of the epics.

I understand the point behind CoVs is proving your loyalty to Archnos and all, but it's also about you being a villian and most villians I've read about in comic books hate taking orders from anyone and would rather keep thier independence and work solo.

The thing I'd like to see is give villians access to the epic sets and give them a choice, the epic sets or the patron sets. And likewise for heros, they get something like the patron sets. I think that would add a balance to both sides.

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01/15/07 21:08

Sapir

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

With the new Inventions System, and an interesting suggestion on the OB's which is getting a lot of backing at the moment, I dont think that PPP's or APP's are going to be much of a concern in the future.

In the long run, it's all a matter of what works for you. Some people (including myself) have found great utility in the PPP's. While others cant get them to work with either their concepts or builds at all. Like I stated previously, I have had that problem with my Eng/Eng Blaster. The APP's didnt impress me for that toon for both reasons. I finally took Electric Mastery, but I'm not near as happy with that as with Soul Mastery on my MM and Corrupter.

Actually, I have to wonder if the PPP's werent designed specifically with the upcoming Inventions System in mind. The way some things have worked out since CoV launch; I would say that is a good possibility.

01/16/07 07:18

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

WEll i have finally gotten to 45 ((woot) and i got makos patrons only becuase the hols is a dot and the first power is a DoT so i am liking them and i have founf them very useful but yeah upcoming inventions should be sweet to use with everything

01/16/07 08:33

Professor Crackpot

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

Mako is a great Patron to chose (right next to Ghost Widow of course).

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01/16/07 21:04

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

Yeah am 47 now and got the pet... like a mini eath controller/stone brute he is much fun

01/17/07 22:46

Mohawk_Death

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

QUOTE

Actaully I have in a way built this MM to help with his pets. I like fighting with them and healing them. I hate just standing around in a fight.

Guardian Server
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Mohawk Death Level 50 Ninjas/Dark Miasma/Mu Mastery MM
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01/18/07 22:28

mendedkaos

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

i have a 46 NRG/KIN and i selected ghost widow for her holds and the first power option I took was a deffense to smashing and leathal. Let me also add i tried to see how it helped my build in pvp and in missions, but in the end the defffense was nearly useless. Maybe I was careless in adding to my toon with acrobatics and aid self for disorient but haveing a deffense that can be untoggled at the drop of a hat is not helpful. If a choice for holds or immob was giving i would rather have that and sacrifice head to head pwnig i will recieve for thinking i have damage resistance.

01/18/07 23:29

Noxrider

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

Well, I'm no drooling fan of the PPPs for villains, either, but I'd like to mention what I think the devs had in mind: attempting to fill a "gap" in the powersets of the main ATs for villains.

As a level 40 stalker (for months, until I7 was released), I was a pretty decent melee fighter--sure, not a Brute, but I could hold my own, especially with Kuji-In Retsu that I picked up in my Tier 9 secondary.

What was I missing, then? Any sort of ranged power. For Stalkers, it's about the only type of power that can't be gotten. Of course, Spines primary blasts out, but even that is at pretty close range. For my nin/nin stalker, though, it was up-close and personal.

Like most stalkers, I didn't really need a heal, because my secondary offered one. As a matter of fact, I'm not sure, but I think that all the stalker secondaries offer either a self-heal or enough + DEF buffs to prevent a lot of damage, as long as you'll play as a Stalker rather than a Brute (a Stute? a Bralker?). With the tier 9 secondary in some sets, slotted correctly, you can grant yourself a semi-invincibility for about 2-3 minutes, which works great in PvE, maybe not so great in PvP.

So, I think that (for stalkers, at least), they were attempting to take each AT and grant it something to balance out the powersets' tactical deficiencies. By the time you're level 41, assuming you didn't just PL a character to that level, you should know how to play the AT in a way that doesn't need the PPP's. By that point, you've learned how to deal with your deficiency, which makes being able to compensate for it with a power almost useless.

I picked Scirocco, just because I like lightning, and it looks good with my character. Do I use the potential crit-Snipe on him? Hardly ever. In PvE, the ranged hold is good, but in PvP, you can't expect anyone to get caught in it. And the pet? Sure, you'll get comments about it (wow, look a Mu pet--where's that from?), but you really don't have enough remaining enhancement slots to assign to make it live up to its potential.

I'd imagine that, if you look at the PPP's from a bland perspective of just "what the AT is missing," rather than "powers that would be useful," you'd see what the devs were attempting to do. They did manage that well, although I feel like many of you when you day, "What's the point?"

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02/15/07 02:05

BishopDon

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

Some good points there.

I actually read in an interview from Posi i believe, when it comes to the PPP's they are strictly for RP purposes and they didn't want to attempt to create new powers due to balancing concerns and more griefing (as if the current PPPs didn't bring any). He basically said that what's there is what's going to be there and they are not going to change and no thoughts are going to be mustered to changed them either.

I guess they're trying to keep the Role Play theme alive, and based on how you select your Patron and then the powers, I can see it. Again, I'm not a big fan of the choices, however, I like the ranged option for my Stalker and from the sounds of it, one of the few that actually uses the pet Mu on a consistent basis. I use the Snipe and the ranged attack as part of my attack progression, so I guess I'm weird then..hmmmm.

I'll see if I can find the interview notes and post them when I get a chance.

02/15/07 07:25

Orcis

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

I personally think that the PPP is a complete waist of powers. With perhaps one exception and thats Scorpians armor for the defense. Other than that a total waist of what could have been a good thing.

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02/15/07 09:39

Nova302

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

You know what it is, its that they are trying to make the heroes happy, you know they feel villains are overpowered and wanted to make it more balanced, now if that's not just a pile of bull. and whats even funnier is that they are STILL trying to make the heroes happy in i9, thats why we STILL didnt get our epic AT's and thats why we wont until issue 10 - issue 11.

***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***

02/15/07 09:47

BishopDon

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RE: Patron Powers. Are they helpful?

Here is the link with the discussion about the PPPs. The discussion is quite frank and to the point. Read it and weep.

Oh, there are other items and areas mentioned as well....

Corruptors carring Pistols???? Oh my...

02/15/07 14:02

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