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kyro27
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im assuming that most of the people who come to this site are mainly pve players and/or people who are new to pvp.
the reason i am assuming this and making this thread is because theres so many people making threads on this site about how bad nerfs are etc, while pve is a big part of this game, pvp is in fact a larger part of it(imho), and being the same skills in both, skills have to suffer just as much. there have been some skill nerfs in that were intended pve that effected pvp, and vice versa. i really think some of you people should keep this in mind before you make a thread complaining about skill nerfs.
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| 01/22/07 22:59 |
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Brynden
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There's a lot of things you really need to keep in mind before complaining about skill changes, I'm not going to say nerfs, because most of them aren't really nerfs. However, I can't really get upset at all the people complaining about how their favorite farming build was ruined. The bottom line is that people play a class and build and grow to love it, and then when something is changed, they jump to the conclusion that their favorite build and class is ruined and will never be fun again. I am not targeting anyone here, I was one of the most vocal people when the capped the amount of minions. It's just a natural reaction. We just have to hope that when this happens, we don't overreact and quit the game before realizing that not all that much has changed.
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| 01/22/07 23:15 |
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NecroRebel
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I definately agree with you. People who complain the loudest about skill changes are usually those who mainly PvE or who mainly use one or two particular builds in PvP, and for the latter people it's especially those who's particular builds are common to many people.
I tend to just laugh at updates myself, since they have almost invariably made my builds more powerful or not affected me directly at all. Part of this is because I intentionally use an attribute or skill that is uncommonly used as the basis for my builds and intentionally avoid using the common builds if at all possible, but then again it might also be because I can make underpowered skills work.
The only times when I have been seriously worried about an update's changes were when the original AI update came out which made enemies flee from AoE effects since I thought that they would flee from my war's Gladiator's Defense farming (they didn't for several months more) and then shortly before Factions came out Savage Slash had its energy cost doubled, which actually ruined my war's build's energy, which caused me to drop that build altogether since it was no longer viable.
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| 01/22/07 23:49 |
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cswella
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| QUOTE | | which caused me to drop that build altogether since it was no longer viable. |
That statement made my night. Not because you lost a build, but because I can picture you shrugging and moving on in a heartbeat.
I do agree on some accounts that the updates are sometimes annoying. I had made my current Elementalist right before the AoE nerf where enemies run if there's AoE, so that killed my enthusiasm for Eles. Not that I hated them, I just didn't feel like playing him.
And I do agree with kyro, PvP isn't to blame for all nerfs. AoE nerf was a big one, didn't have anything to do with PvP. Minion Master nerf was also a big one, and it was both PvP and PvE they did it for.
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| 01/23/07 01:13 |
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DZA
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| QUOTE | I definately agree with you. People who complain the loudest about skill changes are usually those who mainly PvE or who mainly use one or two particular builds in PvP, and for the latter people it's especially those who's particular builds are common to many people.
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MAN I totally Agree with you. Instead of you PvE'rs and 2 bulid PvP'rs complaining all the time just suck it up and deal with it! Create a new build ! I am both a PvP and PvE play so none of these changes bother me at all!
The ones that kill me the most are the ones who complain( More Like senseless crying & Babbling) on the forums saying they are never gonna play again! Like A-net really cares !
Whenever these updates happen, I just say "pffff WHATEVER"
***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***
Anubis Djehuty - Ranger - Master of the Drunken Arrow !!
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| 01/23/07 02:24 |
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Balthamos
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As I stated in a previous post, the reason PvE seems to get hit so hard by nerfs is because there are very few people who will rejoice at the change. This is because no matter how overpowered a skill is nobody will complain. I haven't heard of the Margonites emailing anet demanding an SF nerf, have you? Only with farming nerfs will you hear anything positive from the people who don't believe in solo-farming. Sometimes, that isn't even positive, it only stretches to acceptance.
Edit: Phrasing.
***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***
Edgwalkers is coming.
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| 01/23/07 02:40 |
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Jamnog
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oh :( I thought it was going to be a thread about which we prefer pvp or pve. Its another one about nerfing, well i think people all look at in their own way of course.
Balancing skills is there to make the game more enjoyable for the majority of the players. That is how I see it if it feels like something is over powered like when a necro is running a mission with an mm build or when a monk is soloing uw or when a team wont leave without an echo nuker... that is when the game looses originality there's hundreds of skills. If gamers concentrate on one skill it shows it to be better than the rest thus meaning that skill is unbalancing the game. When i turn up to HA I'm confronted with the "you must use this skill set or you cant play" thus pvp does not offer much attraction to me outside alliance battle that sort of thing. part of the game is to try all the skills on offer and find a skill set that you enjoy playing. finding a profession you enjoy playing. If some one else is playing the game for you its less fun. newbs are good ok there is a wrong way to play the game sure but the ones that are learning for themselves by playing flare warriors are at least experimenting. and if the wrong way to play the game is fun for them I would rather see that than oh err
your a necro so your either ss or mm.
your an ele so you have to go fire
your a warrior so you can tank
your a ranger you cant go interrupt or barrage
your a monk you can't go smite well theres about 10 pages of things monks cant do.
your a rit you spirit bomb
your a sin mungo brain hurt you go tank
your a derv you go grenth
your a paragon mungo brain hurt more now me not know what you do this in ha because its r3 testosterone ruled mayhem and the only way to win is my way and there's no second place. well thanks I already have a job.
anyway you might have reached the conclusion that I'm getting a bit tired of "off the shelf builds" the revolve entirely around one skill. or some guy who followed the list above has been thinking entirely about their prof and how skills would help them look good.
Teams that are in no respect balanced and guys with the best intentions building teams that drain any originality out of the game and rarely involve the entire team working as a team to pick combos that harmonise with other players. /rant end
Looking at this I don't agree with most of what I've said but its in the back of my mind sometimes.
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| 01/23/07 06:53 |
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hairychimpdude
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| QUOTE | your a necro so your either ss or mm.
your an ele so you have to go fire
your a warrior so you can tank
your a ranger you cant go interrupt or barrage
your a monk you can't go smite well theres about 10 pages of things monks cant do.
your a rit you spirit bomb
your a sin mungo brain hurt you go tank
your a derv you go grenth
your a paragon mungo brain hurt more now me not know what you do this in ha because its r3 testosterone ruled mayhem and the only way to win is my way and there's no second place. well thanks I already have a job. |
lollerz roflcoptrs!!
so true, sigh...
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| 01/23/07 07:30 |
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Keo
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| QUOTE |
your a necro so your either ss or mm.
your an ele so you have to go fire
your a warrior so you can tank
your a ranger you cant go interrupt or barrage
your a monk you can't go smite well theres about 10 pages of things monks cant do.
your a rit you spirit bomb
your a sin mungo brain hurt you go tank
your a derv you go grenth
your a paragon mungo brain hurt more now me not know what you do this in ha because its r3 testosterone ruled mayhem and the only way to win is my way and there's no second place. well thanks I already have a job. |
Far too true...however one of my favorites is when a Warrior offers to help the Monks with their 1337 healing skillz!
The recent changes (nerfs) gave me a shock last night when I dropped into UW on my Monk and realised that Rend is now a 1 sec cast! Wasn't until the 2nd trip I noticed the AV/SV change and did some real swearing!
Ele's did well tho...WooT for the recharge change on Lightning Hammer, it's now spamable! And there are changes to Flare & Firestorm which make them both viable skills since the AoE nerf. As well as this Sin's and Rt's have been made a little more powerful and Necro's have been pretty much left alone cos they're perfect.
Me & a mate spent hours last night playing with builds, changing skills and seeing what can be done with the changes and on the whole they are mostly GOOD changes. The only thing they do screw up are specialty builds for farming.
Perhaps now I can find an 8 man team to get back out to the Chaos Plains...'What's that?' I hear people cry! Well it's part of the UW that never gets a look in cos all people do is farm!
^_^
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| 01/23/07 07:32 |
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Seth Oneil
Posts: 4
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| QUOTE | your a necro so your either ss or mm.
your an ele so you have to go fire
your a warrior so you can tank
your a ranger you cant go interrupt or barrage
your a monk you can't go smite well theres about 10 pages of things monks cant do.
your a rit you spirit bomb
your a sin mungo brain hurt you go tank
your a derv you go grenth
your a paragon mungo brain hurt more now me not know what you do this in ha because its r3 testosterone ruled mayhem and the only way to win is my way and there's no second place. well thanks I already have a job. |
Well besides spelling "you're" wrong all the way down the page you described PvE in a nutshell. Whether it was on purpose or not you left out mesmers.... which happens in PvE anyway xD.
This is why I've went over to PvP; Mesmers are actually included, all elements (well minus water....) are usualy considered in PvP builds, (SS warder, blinding surge, thunderclap, etc) and there is a lot more variety in what people will let you do. Like actually deal damage as a warrior
If you were trying to describe PvP instead of PvE... you did a horrible job (oh well). The necromancer profession has widened it's range because of soul reaping.... and the fact that all of their hexes last a year and a half. And Minion factory doesn't really work all that well anymore.
Anyway the only gripe I have is that people don't consider the other side of the story when looking at skill changes. and the fact that once a skill has been changed; there is more than likely going to be a skill that will come along to help that skill out either inthe near future or being chanegd itself.
example would be SoA.
SO just wait around a bit and there will be more skill changes and you'll be able to figure out a new way to do things for a bit.
I think it would get boring to run the same build all day every day anwyay; gotta spice it up here and there.
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| 01/23/07 10:10 |
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Zinnj
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I used to pve only, but really just got bored as it has become less of a challenge imo, and with heros is much harder to find human groups, which made pve fun, so back then, updates would kinda erk me. Now though, I play pve only to cap skills for my couple pve chars i still have, and I play so many different builds and classes now in HA, RA, TA, and gvg that the updates just don't affect me much anymore, short of having to tweak some builds here or there, or nix a build all together for a new one. PvP is where its at imho.
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Zu Z - Assassin
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| 01/23/07 10:20 |
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Jamnog
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| QUOTE | | QUOTE | your a necro so your either ss or mm.
your an ele so you have to go fire
your a warrior so you can tank
your a ranger you cant go interrupt or barrage
your a monk you can't go smite well theres about 10 pages of things monks cant do.
your a rit you spirit bomb
your a sin mungo brain hurt you go tank
your a derv you go grenth
your a paragon mungo brain hurt more now me not know what you do this in ha because its r3 testosterone ruled mayhem and the only way to win is my way and there's no second place. well thanks I already have a job. |
Well besides spelling "you're" wrong all the way down the page you described PvE in a nutshell. Whether it was on purpose or not you left out mesmers.... which happens in PvE anyway xD.
This is why I've went over to PvP; Mesmers are actually included, all elements (well minus water....) are usualy considered in PvP builds, (SS warder, blinding surge, thunderclap, etc) and there is a lot more variety in what people will let you do. Like actually deal damage as a warrior
If you were trying to describe PvP instead of PvE... you did a horrible job (oh well). The necromancer profession has widened it's range because of soul reaping.... and the fact that all of their hexes last a year and a half. And Minion factory doesn't really work all that well anymore.
Anyway the only gripe I have is that people don't consider the other side of the story when looking at skill changes. and the fact that once a skill has been changed; there is more than likely going to be a skill that will come along to help that skill out either inthe near future or being chanegd itself.
example would be SoA.
SO just wait around a bit and there will be more skill changes and you'll be able to figure out a new way to do things for a bit.
I think it would get boring to run the same build all day every day anwyay; gotta spice it up here and there. |
well people have experienced this differently to point out I'm talking HA not pvp I have yet to experience anyone in alliance battles telling me what build I MUST take. all most never get told what to do in pve apart from gates of madness where I was in a pug where everyone in the team discussed what build would work well against a very predictable boss.
so in answer to that I was trying to describe all most every trip to HA not pvp and I disagree that pve is like that or I would have said pve thus I did an excellent job :P
also your is a word, I'm dyslexic I have spell check.
and you spelled anyyay, chanegd and usualy wrong apparently.
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| 01/23/07 17:37 |
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