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GameAmp: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer?

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Forum >> General Discussion >> General Discussion >> Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer?

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Balthamos Profile
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Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

Ok, in response to all the people melting my eyes with anet complaints.

I was reading a thread on guru started by Gaile Grey and came accross this quote.

QUOTE
You know, it would be cool to say "Oh, we give all feedback equal consideration." But the fact is, if a thread is so flamey and so filled with attacks that it makes a locker room smell sweet, the fact is that it may not be read to the depth that the content merits. What's the expression, "You can draw more flies to honey than to vinegar?" Well, if a thread starts bad, and gets worse, if it's poorly written and filled with swear words, name-calling, and attacks on the devs, it's entirely possible that we will have already donned our flame-retardant underwear and moved on to the next thread, without even realizing that underneath the horrible content, there was a small kernel of wisdom.


Basicly, this is what anet thinks of the threads that get turned into flamefests. What you're actually doing is preventing the opinion of other people being seen because once you take you box of matches to the thread it's gonna go up in smoke and get ignored. Start using constructive arguments and justifying your points about what you think needs changing. This way the people who read fansites for anet will actually read threads. If you don't think you can put together a good argument then feel free to quote other people and show where you agree. This will show anet that the support for ideas isn't mindless but thought out.

To conclude:

Read, Think, Criticise, Construct, Post.
02/06/07 13:49 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

yeh, true true



02/06/07 13:52 Topic Locked
cswella Profile
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

I figured that went without saying, but apparently Anet's reading too many flame threads and they're sick of it.

If you think of the customers as the boss, and Anet as the employee, we have to act civil and with respect. Would you want your boss to be constantly yelling and insulting you?





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02/06/07 13:55 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE
I figured that went without saying, but apparently Anet's reading too many flame threads and they're sick of it.

If you think of the customers as the boss, and Anet as the employee, we have to act civil and with respect. Would you want your boss to be constantly yelling and insulting you?


lol, my ''boss'' the teacher yells at me all the time.. you get used to it :)





Name: Silvanox
02/06/07 13:57 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

I don't see why i would flame in the first place, sure, they did some bad stuff according to most people, and yes some things got harder. But going immediatly hostile against every single one of them is wrong, especially if amongst all the bad comments your trying to tell your suggestions.

Ofcourse, not all of us think that way, and its good too since otherwise we'd be clones, but by flaming them immediatly will just ruin the entire topic, just tell your problems and troubles, concerns and whatsoever, but stick to that and don't turn it into yet another flame post in the end. Just get straight to the point, and keep all your angry feelings out of it for a moment.



02/06/07 14:01 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

Good find balth.


Though i think AMP has less of a problem with that than guru does =p




IGN: Rogue Mysst. Guest me for GvG.
02/06/07 14:20 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

the difference between guru and amp is that on amp the flamers are taken care of. on guru they run rampant or the rules against them are so lax that they might as well not be there.



02/06/07 14:25 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

And there the "elite" site...bah!



Cool Links:
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• Screenshots, Images and Signatures by Evil Geek

02/06/07 14:42 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

Let's not flame Guru please, lets face it, outright anet flames do happen here. It's player/player flames that gameamp is really strongly oppose. I posted this to hopefully encourage people to either write well constructed posts in order to get their views across better and more respect from the anet staff. There were a few topics with detailed discussion, gone with R&R though.



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02/06/07 15:13 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE
If you think of the customers as the boss, and Anet as the employee, we have to act civil and with respect. Would you want your boss to be constantly yelling and insulting you?


Quoted for truth and +cred for wisdom. I believe most everyone believe it's vice versa. They believe Anet is a lame boss and they are the victimized employees, and should be "treated" better, or they'll "quit" their job and let Anet go Bankrupt.




02/06/07 15:18 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

Lol so Anet will stop reading fansite forums, it's not like they ever care what we have to say anyways.



Transformeurs, more than meets the eye.

02/06/07 15:25 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE
Lol so Anet will stop reading fansite forums, it's not like they ever care what we have to say anyways.


guess you have no clue how wrong you are...

Balthamos +creds for this post!






02/06/07 15:27 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

Thank you for posting this Blathamos
02/06/07 18:55 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE
Lol so Anet will stop reading fansite forums, it's not like they ever care what we have to say anyways.


They do care, but i would also start to care less and less if i'd find flaming and such in every post and suggestion, it would make my eyes bleed.




02/06/07 19:15 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE
flame-retardant underwear


Gaile Gray slays me sometimes. I laughed out loud at that one.

'Tis a very good thing to post this. We do need to take the time to think through our concerns, analyze them and then come up with a well-thought-out answer. Otherwise, we come across as a bunch of loudmouths that really can't back up their accusations or concerns.

I think we should take this up as a challenge here at GameAmp. If we have an issue, as a community we should pride ourselves in insightful, intelligent discussions about solutions to this problem. Ranting and raving will get us nowhere, other than surrounded by a bunch of firefighters.

+cred for bringing this to our attention and for the eye-catching thread title



02/06/07 20:10 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

I understand what you guys are saying and I agree to a certain degree. What I don't agree with is the way Anet automatically ignores the flame posts. Yeah, it's true that flames are bad and that they can be annoying, but they still get the message across. Got a flame about armor prices? Anet should get the idea that something is wrong with the prices....prolly being too high. Got a flame about 6v6 Heroes' Ascent? Anet should get the message that we liked 8v8 better. Got a flame about henchmen AI? Anet should get the message that henchmen can be pretty stupid in their tactics and are useless at times. (I don't have any complaints or flames about these particular subjects, I was just using them as examples.) My point is, whether it's a flame or constructive criticism, Anet should get the point of the complaint regardless. They would have to have the mentality of a slug to not get the point.

And I also understand what you guys mean by saying that it would suck to have a boss yelling at you all the time. Well guess what? It happens all the freaking time in the real world! Get use to it! Some people actually consider yelling a form of constructive critcism (thought most people don't). And that's just the way some people are naturally...they yell and gripe. (And if any of you say that all bosses aren't like that....you're right, but that doesn't mean you are always going to get the nice boss that you want.)

The point that I'm trying to get across here is that, in my opinion, Anet is being either to lazy by not reading the flame posts or that they are just a bunch of wussies who can't take criticism. If I had thousands of people yelling at me about doing something wrong, I guarantee all of you that I would be trying my best to fix the problem. You gotta take the good with the bad....Anet is gonna get constructive criticism and they are gonna get flames. They just need to get use to both and learn how to fix the problems presented in both.

So to sum this all up, Anet needs to toughen it up a little and learn how to take crap from people. (Because let's face it, everyone is gonna take crap from people at some time in their lives and they'll have to learn how to deal with it....other than just ignoring the problem.) If Anet ignores the flames, they are just screwing themselves over because they still aren't getting the message to fix something. So my message to Anet is this....If you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen. (Not original I know, but I think it fits this situation perfectly.)

P.S. This is not intended as a flame to Anet. Just my way of telling Anet how to fix their so called "ignore flames" problem. The End.



02/06/07 21:35 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE

And I also understand what you guys mean by saying that it would suck to have a boss yelling at you all the time. Well guess what? It happens all the freaking time in the real world! Get use to it! Some people actually consider yelling a form of constructive critcism (thought most people don't). And that's just the way some people are naturally...they yell and gripe. (And if any of you say that all bosses aren't like that....you're right, but that doesn't mean you are always going to get the nice boss that you want.)

The point that I'm trying to get across here is that, in my opinion, Anet is being either to lazy by not reading the flame posts or that they are just a bunch of wussies who can't take criticism. If I had thousands of people yelling at me about doing something wrong, I guarantee all of you that I would be trying my best to fix the problem. You gotta take the good with the bad....Anet is gonna get constructive criticism and they are gonna get flames. They just need to get use to both and learn how to fix the problems presented in both.

So to sum this all up, Anet needs to toughen it up a little and learn how to take crap from people. (Because let's face it, everyone is gonna take crap from people at some time in their lives and they'll have to learn how to deal with it....other than just ignoring the problem.) If Anet ignores the flames, they are just screwing themselves over because they still aren't getting the message to fix something. So my message to Anet is this....If you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen. (Not original I know, but I think it fits this situation perfectly.)

P.S. This is not intended as a flame to Anet. Just my way of telling Anet how to fix their so called "ignore flames" problem. The End.


Okay, how about you be the one hired to read through 75+ pages of idiots repeating the same crap in leet-speak and screaming at each other about frivolous things.

We here at AMP don't have the level of flaming that Guru and other sites have. It's not just "people complaining", it's people completely attacking each other and Anet.

My example was meant more for this site, I guess a different example is needed for other sites that I've seen:

It's kinda like getting beat up by every single gang in New York City with every variety of weapon available.





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02/06/07 22:16 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE
Lol so Anet will stop reading fansite forums, it's not like they ever care what we have to say anyways.


They do care about what they want and not what we need

+ Cred







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02/06/07 22:38 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

Bump; hopefully it will make people consider more what they type.




necromancer all the way
02/07/07 02:41 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

Nice find Balth, +cred



02/07/07 04:28 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE
I understand what you guys are saying and I agree to a certain degree. What I don't agree with is the way Anet automatically ignores the flame posts.


mmmm ever heard of the word "respect"?
Respect doesn't mean be nice and never disagree..
if you don't know it, you can find it
here

your latest post (this one) is a nice example of disrespect (the opposite of respect ^^)
I cannot agree more with A'net then to ignore threads who consist out of swearing, insulting and flaming!

Humanity is supposed to be civilized, and by that, the language they use should be the same..
Maybe some of you guys think swearing, insulting and flaming is a way of showing how though you are, how 'mature' you are.. But in fact, non of those posts are considered 'useful ' to me regardless of the content

And I know I'm not the only one who thinks like this ;-)

grtz



02/07/07 04:53 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

Do the ANet staff actually pay attention to GameAmp? Do they ever post here?

Anyway....

I'd suggest that the first post + quote is stickied or added to the forum guidelines since it highlights nicely the problem of unconstructed flaming and petty sheep like name calling.

^_^



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02/07/07 04:57 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE
Do the ANet staff actually pay attention to GameAmp? Do they ever post here?

Yes they do; they look here and leave posts. They arent active posters but when there is something they wish to say or point out; they post it.




necromancer all the way
02/07/07 05:10 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE
Do the ANet staff actually pay attention to GameAmp? Do they ever post here?


They do visit a lot and look at the site a lot ;-) But not always under the name of 'Arenanet'

One for example who does post here and is a guy from NCSoft, is Alex Weekes
The rest remains undercover ;-) which I can't blame them.. Imagin how many PM's they would get...

grtz



02/07/07 05:14 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

If a humble player like me doesnt pay attention to flamin threads..why sould devs do??

Its just common sense.

"Just say no to flame" :P



02/07/07 09:04 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

Nice find!

Well I do think it's about time ANET spoke out and let people know what they think of all these flamefests threads.

But I don't think we (Game AMP community) are anywhere close to that, complaints yes! And lots of them, but most of the complaints here are done in a constructive way, where people speak out their thoughts about the game and GW updates.

This is what I think ANET should do, since most people are complaining or usually complain about the updates, if they can't give us something they know for a fact we're going to appreciate, don't give us anything at all.

Yes, that's what I said, maybe then after three - four months people will start realizing that sometimes these updates are for our good and the balance of the game, now imagine if they never updated the gear trick, you would only see people farming Sorrow's Furnace and never in Cantha or Elona, do you get what I'm saying?

What I'm trying to say is, they "nerf" certain things to keep people from being concentrated in one area only, when they "nerfed" the gear trick, people had to come with new ways, new "PLACES" to farm, and then they move along, going to Cantha and other areas in the game, why do you think sometimes you’re the only one in an outpost? Because everyone else is too busy farming in Thunderhead Keep (just an example), and that is why you don’t see people in the Ironmines.

Ok, now in defense of us (GW players). I do think that ANET should consider sometimes updating the game in a way that they know for a fact (like stated above) that we would like, their new update “moving mouths” that is awesome it adds more to the game, now if they added an Auction House, that everyone asks for, people would love ANET even more, and us (GW players) would give ANET a time to breath. I do not mean necessarily just the Auction House would do it, but it’s on of the things players would love, for a FACT!

Anyways, we are “WE” the Game AMP community, we will always speak out and we will be loud when we do it, but we will also try to keep it as clean and constructive as possible, maybe it be in form of complaints or ideas, but like I said that’s just us.

Also don’t forget ANET we do what we do because we care, also the game has provided us with lots of fun and entertainment so far, let’s keep it that way :D

-Meumesmo.




02/07/07 09:38 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE
I understand what you guys are saying and I agree to a certain degree. What I don't agree with is the way Anet automatically ignores the flame posts. Yeah, it's true that flames are bad and that they can be annoying, but they still get the message across. Got a flame about armor prices? Anet should get the idea that something is wrong with the prices....prolly being too high. Got a flame about 6v6 Heroes' Ascent? Anet should get the message that we liked 8v8 better. Got a flame about henchmen AI? Anet should get the message that henchmen can be pretty stupid in their tactics and are useless at times. (I don't have any complaints or flames about these particular subjects, I was just using them as examples.) My point is, whether it's a flame or constructive criticism, Anet should get the point of the complaint regardless. They would have to have the mentality of a slug to not get the point.

And I also understand what you guys mean by saying that it would suck to have a boss yelling at you all the time. Well guess what? It happens all the freaking time in the real world! Get use to it! Some people actually consider yelling a form of constructive critcism (thought most people don't). And that's just the way some people are naturally...they yell and gripe. (And if any of you say that all bosses aren't like that....you're right, but that doesn't mean you are always going to get the nice boss that you want.)

The point that I'm trying to get across here is that, in my opinion, Anet is being either to lazy by not reading the flame posts or that they are just a bunch of wussies who can't take criticism. If I had thousands of people yelling at me about doing something wrong, I guarantee all of you that I would be trying my best to fix the problem. You gotta take the good with the bad....Anet is gonna get constructive criticism and they are gonna get flames. They just need to get use to both and learn how to fix the problems presented in both.

So to sum this all up, Anet needs to toughen it up a little and learn how to take crap from people. (Because let's face it, everyone is gonna take crap from people at some time in their lives and they'll have to learn how to deal with it....other than just ignoring the problem.) If Anet ignores the flames, they are just screwing themselves over because they still aren't getting the message to fix something. So my message to Anet is this....If you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen. (Not original I know, but I think it fits this situation perfectly.)

P.S. This is not intended as a flame to Anet. Just my way of telling Anet how to fix their so called "ignore flames" problem. The End.


QUOTE

mmmm ever heard of the word "respect"?
Respect doesn't mean be nice and never disagree..
if you don't know it, you can find it
here

your latest post (this one) is a nice example of disrespect (the opposite of respect ^^)
I cannot agree more with A'net then to ignore threads who consist out of swearing, insulting and flaming!

Humanity is supposed to be civilized, and by that, the language they use should be the same..
Maybe some of you guys think swearing, insulting and flaming is a way of showing how though you are, how 'mature' you are.. But in fact, non of those posts are considered 'useful ' to me regardless of the content

And I know I'm not the only one who thinks like this ;-)

grtz


I usually regard you as a very credibile person, but when did that give you the autorithy to hang out others and make fun of them? He made a sensible post, and by no means did he use any foul words (of course, freaking might be considered). You have no right whatsoever to judge him in the first place by what he have done before, his past should have nothing to do with this post. Speaking of being civilized, I'm sure you have heard the expression "to give someone a second chance"?


I'm leaning toward agreeing what zephyr says. He's got a point when he's saying that flames also is a way of getting through a message (but it is a VERY bad way to do it), and thus A-net should be able to see that people actually voice their opinions. Sometimes the opinions are good (like the update with adding moving lips in proph and factions), sometimes the feedback will be mixed (the latest skill update), and sometimes you will get bad feedback, which usually means flames... People (usually) flame because they are outraged about something, and they do actually have a opinion then! So in such ways, I think A-net is acting a bit strange, and turning the blind eye on here... I would of course not like to gain all that negative feedback, but that kind of feedback is usually given because the users think the update is WRONG.

This isn't my opinion, I don't think the update was wrong in any means, but they should be able to see that others don't like it. And people should be able to post it. In my opinion, any feedback is good feedback, what it actually shows is that people care and that is a very important matter.


Please Trib, the next time you are in a discussion with someone, try to stick to the point. This is in no way intended as a flame, but I think that there are better ways to act when having a discussion...



***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***



02/07/07 11:21 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

So this basicly means that arenanet can't take critisism, and just ignores post that contain lots of hostile criticism against anet.
The way I see it if somebody posts some topic that contains a lot of hostile criticism, its quickly described as a flame by a lot of people.

Flaming is a hostile and/or insulting mssg according to wiki. If criticism(hostile or not) is seen as a flame, then a forum isnt a forum anymore. Forums are ment to be able to let people share their oppinion, positive, or negative.
Even when a post is hostile, as long as it isn't insulting, i think this is alright. If someone is truly mad at/about something, he/she should be able to express him/herself.

I hope people will agree.



02/07/07 11:27 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

I see what you are saying about a forum is meant to be positive and negative, BUT

Gameamp is a fansite forum for Guild Wars, another thing is there is a fine line between criticism, and rambunctious bashing.



***Jade Shane....Monk Shane....Aziah Shane....Crypto Shane....Sol Shane....Jordon Shane....newest member Lily Shane!....and last but not least Lei Shane....The Shane family of Guild Wars***


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02/07/07 11:57 Topic Locked
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RE: Want to be heard? Flame ANET! - Oops, wrong answer? 

QUOTE
You know, it would be cool to say "Oh, we give all feedback equal consideration." But the fact is, if a thread is so flamey and so filled with attacks that it makes a locker room smell sweet, the fact is that it may not be read to the depth that the content merits. What's the expression, "You can draw more flies to honey than to vinegar?" Well, if a thread starts bad, and gets worse, if it's poorly written and filled with swear words, name-calling, and attacks on the devs, it's entirely possible that we will have already donned our flame-retardant underwear and moved on to the next thread, without even realizing that underneath the horrible content, there was a small kernel of wisdom.


I think, at this point, it's important to take a step back and read Gaile's post again. I really think that we're getting off-track here. ANet DOES read as many posts as they possibly can, but we have to understand that the crew there is not going to read through reams of posts that are "poorly written and filled with swear words, name-calling, and attacks on the devs." And can you really blame them? How is acting like that in any way productive?

Her post was not meant to be taken that ANet doesn't read comments, concerns, heated debates or even flames about their product. Rather, her post is a way of gently reminding the community at large that there are better ways of getting their point across. Personally, I think this is a great post and she is to be commended for it.

I will bring up the point again. I've never seen GameAmp degenerate into the "swear words, name-calling and attacks on the devs" that she refers to. We would like to keep it that way. Do like I do, before I write a post about something that I feel personally or emotionally connected to, I take some time to think it through. I live by a motto: "Nothing in life is ever as bad as it seems." By taking the time to mull things over in your head, you can quite often come up with a well-constructed, insightful post that will provoke thought (and quite likely get the attention of the folks over at ANet).

Thanks for listening. Let's keep this discussion civil and take it as an opportunity to better our community.



02/07/07 11:58 Topic Locked

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