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DocterPink
Posts: 4
Joined: 12/22/2006
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Okay, now that my PL toon is 36 and risising quite quickly thanks to XP curving (lovin it!) I was starting to think about epics. So, because my main is a 50 troller, I knew all the sets and the majority of their powers. All I needed was advice. So I sent some tells, looked at some PL troller builds and I discoverd...christ, theres a LOT of builds for PL toons!
Now I really like my Fire/Kin and I want to give the best PL ever (doesn't everyone?) to all my SG mates and friends. But I have no idea what powers to skips/take. Here are some examples of the kinda conflicts I'm having:
Should I take Smoke or not?
What epic set works best with PL'ing?
Should I try and squeeze in Leadership?
Should I skip Super Jump entirely and just get IR as a travel?
And with slotting, what powers should be heavily slotted or just totally ignored?
I really have no clue. I was going to get Stone Mastery and stick with the build I got which looks like this:
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.30
http://www.honourableunited.org.uk/mhd.php
Level 37 Technology Controller
Primary Power Set: Fire Control
Secondary Power Set: Kinetics
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Speed
Hero Profile:
------------
Level 1: Char Acc(A), Hold(3), Hold(11), RechRdx(31)
Level 1: Transfusion Acc(A), Heal(7), Heal(11)
Level 2: Fire Cages Acc(A), Immob(3), EndRdx(7), RechRdx(34)
Level 4: Siphon Power Acc(A), RechRdx(5), RechRdx(5)
Level 6: Combat Jumping DefBuff(A)
Level 8: Hot Feet EndRdx(A), EndRdx(9), EndRdx(9), Dmg(34)
Level 10: Swift Run(A)
Level 12: Flashfire Acc(A), Acc(13), RechRdx(13), RechRdx(15), RechRdx(15), Dsrnt(27)
Level 14: Super Jump Jump(A)
Level 16: Health Heal(A), Heal(17), Heal(17)
Level 18: Cinders Acc(A), Acc(19), Hold(19), RechRdx(25), RechRdx(25), RechRdx(27)
Level 20: Siphon Speed Acc(A), RechRdx(21), RechRdx(21)
Level 22: Stamina EndMod(A), EndMod(23), EndMod(23)
Level 24: Speed Boost EndMod(A)
Level 26: Acrobatics EndRdx(A)
Level 28: Hasten RechRdx(A), RechRdx(29), RechRdx(29)
Level 30: Smoke ToHitDeb(A), ToHitDeb(31), ToHitDeb(31)
Level 32: Fire Imps Dmg(A), Dmg(33), Dmg(33), Acc(33), Acc(34)
Level 35: Transference Acc(A), Acc(36), EndMod(36), RechRdx(36)
Level 38: [Empty]
Level 41: [Empty]
Level 44: [Empty]
Level 47: [Empty]
Level 49: [Empty]
------------
Level 1: Brawl Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest Empty(A)
Level 1: Containment
So, does anyone have any good tips/advice/suggestions for a really good PL toon? Thanks for helping me out once again!
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| 02/19/08 12:50 |
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Midnight-Ice
Posts: 27
Joined: 08/09/2007
Credibility: 0 pts
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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So your saying that your going to make a powerlevelin toon?
heh so am i!!
Theres a lot of things you need in that build, and a lot of things that you dont. like smoke, its useless cuz ur going to attack the mob anyways
and for the epics, the farmers usually choose fire mastery for quicker kills.
Let me get back to you with this, ima check with my SG about this.
Triumph
Extreme Pyro Level 50 Fire/kinetics Controller
Kritical Hero Level 32 Spines/Regeneration Scrapper
Maxx Vicious level 38 Willpower/Superstrength
WILL PL YOU
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| 02/19/08 12:59 |
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Lightfoot27
Posts: 1
Joined: 01/16/2007
Credibility: 0 pts
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Pretty much what midnight said. Smoke is useless for a PL'er as you will be killing them faster than you can smoke them. Also, the accuracy debuff on this is pretty minimal so its more useful for making baddies unaware of your presence which, again, isn't really need for pl'ing.
As for epics, I would tend to take two routes. My choice was fire for fireball, a good aoe and its up fairly frequently. Fire shield is a bonus against elemental dmg as well... and consume is always handy to have just incase you bleed yourself dry and transference isn't up yet.
The other choice? Psionics for the mez resist. Psionic tornodo is an okay attack as well and the shield includes psionic resist. Those two pools would be my choice, however, I've seen ice used rather well also.
For travel, I would definitely dip into leaping... just for acrobatics. This is fantastic against enemies such as council or praetorians (as many have knockback) and will just make your day that much more pleasant. Also, superjump is quick and accurate and combat jumping provides a little extra defense which is always good. Combo this with superspeed and you're flying through the level as well as having the bonus of hasten. As a fire/kin you'll notice the bad guys dropping faster than you can recharge your powers so in my opinion hasten comes in very handy here, as do IO -recharge sets. This again, combines well with the fire epic set as you'll now have consume and transference to keep your endurance at max while focusing on slotting attacks for holds, recharge and dmg.
Of course this is all just my 2 inf. worth but its served me quite well on my 43 fire/kin and my 50 stone/kin.
BEST TEST ANSWERS EVER!
"Who was responsible for inventing the cotton gin?"
"I'm unable to divulge that information as it may compromise our agents in the field."
"What was the date of Columbus' journey to the americas?"
"I do not believe in linear time, the past and future are one, existence in the temporal sense is illusionary... this question is therefore meaningless and impossible to answer."
-Calvin and Hobbes
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| 02/19/08 13:09 |
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BigChill
Posts: 54
Joined: 10/26/2007
Credibility: 0 pts
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Okay, I hate farming, it ruins the enjoyment of the game. But the market forces it. I hate PLs cause you miss so much if your new. Now, for those that have been around, it depends, but your not going to get the hang of your toon off the bat most of the time if you never use them. You'll get bored, and wander off to another toon. But, to each his own, and I'm not gonna just turn my back just because of that, so here is what I know about this stuff.
I'm sure you know, but the best maps are outdoor, limited levels, and very open. You run, kill, and repeat. This is done with the intention of it being fase, and very high on the damage scale. Its not the Imps, or the hold, but the AoEs that cause the insaie damage. The holds are to limit whats taken, the imomb so you don't run, and the Imps are just a perk.
You start by doing what you can to limit the mob's ability, smoke followed by cages, cinders rush in, kin trans then just spam hotfeet and flashfire for the contanment+buff dmg.
Because of the expected maps, and if you can reliably follow the patteern, SJ is thrown out the window for more damage. Just use hrdle and run sprint with jump heights so you can clear the walls.
Spam Siphon Speed and Power to just make sure everything's capped. This will nearly make it a perma-hasten. You could push it a bit and swap slots for a 6-slotted siphon, acc/rech and you will be recharging like mad.
All said slotting is for recharge and accuracy. Where you want damage, its there, but the buff and containments will have you throwing numbers you won't believe. Stamina could be tossed out for Bonfire, but the KB could get annoying. So I say keep it just to make sure you've got end.
Leaderships are for you as much as your Imps. Added with smoke, is quite reliabel defense for you in most cases, but you won't need it. Tactics is a tohit buff, and that means a far more accurate AoE, and assult for dmg, and manuvers as stated so you can save a bit on Transfusion. Trasn is more for your Imps, less time summoning them, and they have less health, you don't need to worry about maxing it.
Now the Epics:
There are two that can be thrown out off the bat. Psionic and Primal. Noting of benifit there, the Psi's tornado is nice, but its that KB that you'll hate. Primal's only benifit is the Boost for +special, and the mob won't last that long. Your also already capped for dmg, and end is no issue.
The other 3 all have their own perks.
Fire is the accepted choice. Adds 2 fast-charging AoE and res vs fire. Great for demon arcane farms. That, and 2 AoEs added in the mix only adds to the dmg output.
Ice is a slightly better alternative if you want more safety. Smoke+Manuvers+Ice Armor makes your surprisingly safe against Family and other smash/lethal foes. Ice Storm does more dmg than Fire Ball on a per application, but fire recharges faster. With Ice, you'll need to go a bit slower. But, Hibernate gives you an off-the-bat 'oh crap' button.
Now, if your new at this, Stone is a better choice. Rock Armor adds with Manuvers and smoke, Fissure is good for dmg migation, if you can hold off on the immobs, and you gain a dull pain power Earth's Embrace. Added health will keep you alive a bit longer.
So, anyway, that's the basice, this is a rough, but standard fire/kin/pyre farming/pl build for you:
+---------------------------------------------
+ Built with SuckerPunch's Online Planner
+ http://www.cohplanner.com
+---------------------------------------------
Name: N/A
Level: 50
Archetype: Controller
Primary: Fire Control
Secondary: Kinetics
+---------------------------------------------
01 => Transfusion
Accuracy(1)
Accuracy(3)
Accuracy(15)
Attack Rate(17)
Attack Rate(17)
Attack Rate(19)
01 => Char
Accuracy(1)
02 => Fire Cages
Accuracy(2)
Accuracy(3)
Accuracy(15)
Attack Rate(43)
Attack Rate(46)
04 => Siphon Power
Accuracy(4)
Accuracy(5)
Accuracy(5)
06 => Hasten
Attack Rate(6)
Attack Rate(7)
Attack Rate(7)
08 => Hot Feet
Accuracy(8)
Accuracy(9)
Damage(9)
Damage(43)
Attack Rate(46)
10 => Siphon Speed
Accuracy(10)
Accuracy(11)
Accuracy(11)
12 => Flashfire
Accuracy(12)
Accuracy(13)
Damage(13)
Damage(43)
Attack Rate(46)
14 => Super Speed
Running Speed(14)
16 => Hurdle
Jump(16)
18 => Health
Heal(18)
Heal(19)
20 => Stamina
Endurance Modification(20)
Endurance Modification(21)
Endurance Modification(21)
22 => Smoke
Accuracy(22)
Accuracy(23)
Accuracy(23)
Attack Rate(31)
Attack Rate(34)
Attack Rate(37)
24 => Cinders
Accuracy(24)
Accuracy(25)
Attack Rate(25)
Attack Rate(40)
26 => Maneuvers
Endurance Cost(26)
Defense Buff(27)
Defense Buff(27)
Defense Buff(31)
28 => Tactics
Endurance Cost(28)
ToHit Buff(29)
ToHit Buff(29)
ToHit Buff(31)
30 => Assault
Endurance Cost(30)
32 => Fire Imps
Accuracy(32)
Accuracy(33)
Accuracy(33)
Damage(33)
Damage(34)
Damage(34)
35 => Transference
Accuracy(35)
Accuracy(36)
Accuracy(36)
Attack Rate(36)
Attack Rate(37)
Attack Rate(37)
38 => Fulcrum Shift
Accuracy(38)
Accuracy(39)
Accuracy(39)
Attack Rate(39)
Attack Rate(40)
Attack Rate(40)
41 => Fire Ball
Accuracy(41)
Accuracy(42)
Damage(42)
Damage(42)
44 => Fire Shield
Endurance Cost(44)
Damage Resistance(45)
Damage Resistance(45)
Damage Resistance(45)
47 => Consume
Accuracy(47)
Accuracy(48)
Damage(48)
Damage(48)
Attack Rate(50)
Attack Rate(50)
49 => Fire Blast
Accuracy(49)
Accuracy(50)
01 => Sprint
Jump()
01 => Brawl
Accuracy()
02 => Rest
Attack Rate()
+---------------------------------------------
Use mostly SOs, IO sets in the bigger 4-6 slots If you feel like it, but you don't need to. The only reasion for Health is Numina's and Miracle's uniques, if you want it. You really could just skip fitness entirely if you felt lik it, but its a slight safety net you may want. Nerarly any build that includes damage, and for a troller, lots of containment, does well. But this is just your standard farm/pl build that's out there.
Big Chill is a conscranker: he conrols a mob so they do nothing, scraps a target till they can't stand, and tanks what's left till the job's done.
Dive in, have fun, and think about it later.
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| 02/19/08 13:44 |
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Lightfoot27
Posts: 1
Joined: 01/16/2007
Credibility: 0 pts
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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I agree with alot of what big chill says with a few exceptions. While I like the fitness as your travel power idea... this really only works if you are planning this toon as a PL only toon. Myself, I build them primarily for PL but to be well rounded as well so in my opinion, take at least one form of travel power.
The other two things are minor changes. He's right about the aoe's but the imps are also quite significant. Count on using them to draw aggro and try to keep them in range for fulcrum shift, they are quite powerful. Personally, If you are going to take leadership, I'd just take assault and tactics, manuevers doesn't deliver bang for that slot. Also, tp friend at lvl 49 is pretty much a necessity for a PL'er, just for the ease of bringing in lowbies. Then for when a follower gets stuck or if you want to move around. Lately I've been having fun PLing in RWZ and tp friend comes in handy there.
BEST TEST ANSWERS EVER!
"Who was responsible for inventing the cotton gin?"
"I'm unable to divulge that information as it may compromise our agents in the field."
"What was the date of Columbus' journey to the americas?"
"I do not believe in linear time, the past and future are one, existence in the temporal sense is illusionary... this question is therefore meaningless and impossible to answer."
-Calvin and Hobbes
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| 02/19/08 14:51 |
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Warron Peace
Posts: 0
Joined: 06/06/2006
Credibility: 0 pts
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Go away Chill, leave the Fire/Kin farming builds to the experts. I did write the guide to Fire/Kin, after all. :D
Here's a fully expanded build that I'll eventually respec into, once I get my TFs out of the way. My current build is identical, but I have Speed Boost in place of Smoke. For a team situation, where the team is actually helping me, SB is better to have. For a pure farming build, Smoke is more valuable, as it can help prevent over-aggro. Trust me on this, when I'm farming I can find multiple uses for Smoke while SB just sits in my tray unused. No, I don't even SB my imps. They don't need the endurance boost, they don't need the extra speed, and they don't need the +recharge. They are fine as is, so I don't waste the time tossing it out at them.
Anyway, once I have TF commander and have gotten the badges from the STF (which I don't really care about, I just want all my 50s to have successfully done the STF), I'll likely respec out of SB and into Smoke, as for farming its -perception would be pretty valuable to me. Here's the build for pure farming joy:
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.30
http://www.honourableunited.org.uk/mhd.php
Blazing Peace: Level 50 Mutation Controller
Primary Power Set: Fire Control
Secondary Power Set: Kinetics
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Teleportation
Ancillary Pool: Fire Mastery
Hero Profile:
------------
Level 1: Char
(A) Ghost Widow's Embrace - Accuracy/Hold/Recharge
Level 1: Transfusion
(A) Accuracy IO
(40) Doctored Wounds - Heal
(40) Doctored Wounds - Recharge
(43) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Endurance
(43) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Recharge
(46) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Endurance/Recharge
Level 2: Fire Cages
(A) Positron's Blast - Chance of Damage(Energy)
(3) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(3) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage
(37) Positron's Blast - Damage/Endurance
(37) Positron's Blast - Damage/Recharge
Level 4: Ring of Fire
(A) Decimation - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(5) Decimation - Accuracy/Damage
(5) Decimation - Damage/Endurance
(19) Decimation - Damage/Recharge
(21) Decimation - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
Level 6: Hasten
(A) Recharge Reduction IO
(7) Recharge Reduction IO
(7) Recharge Reduction IO
Level 8: Hot Feet
(A) Scirocco's Dervish - Chance of Damage(Lethal)
(9) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(9) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage
(17) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Endurance
(19) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Recharge
Level 10: Siphon Speed
(A) Accuracy IO
(11) Recharge Reduction IO
(11) Recharge Reduction IO
(17) Recharge Reduction IO
Level 12: Flashfire
(A) Stupefy - Accuracy/Stun/Recharge
(13) Stupefy - Accuracy/Recharge
(13) Stupefy - Endurance/Stun
(15) Stupefy - Accuracy/Endurance
(15) Stupefy - Stun/Range
Level 14: Super Speed
(A) Celerity - +Stealth
Level 16: Hurdle
(A) Jumping IO
Level 18: Cinders
(A) Ghost Widow's Embrace - Chance of Damage(Psionic)
(46) Ghost Widow's Embrace - Accuracy/Hold/Recharge
(46) Ghost Widow's Embrace - Accuracy/Recharge
(50) Ghost Widow's Embrace - Endurance/Hold
(50) Neuronic Shutdown - Chance of Damage(Psionic)
Level 20: Health
(A) Numina's Convalescence - +Regeneration/+Recovery
(21) Miracle - +Recovery
Level 22: Stamina
(A) Endurance Modification IO
(23) Endurance Modification IO
(23) Endurance Modification IO
Level 24: Boxing
(A) Crushing Impact - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(25) Crushing Impact - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(25) Crushing Impact - Accuracy/Damage
(34) Crushing Impact - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(34) Crushing Impact - Damage/Endurance
Level 26: Tough
(A) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%
(27) Steadfast Protection - Knockback Protection
(27) Impervium Armor - Resistance
(33) Impervium Armor - Resistance/Endurance
(33) Impervium Armor - Resistance/Recharge
(34) Impervium Armor - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge
Level 28: Weave
(A) Kismet - Accuracy +6%
(29) Kismet - Defense/Endurance
(29) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed
(31) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
(31) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance
(31) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance/Recharge
Level 30: Smoke
(A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge/Endurance
Level 32: Fire Imps
(A) Blood Mandate - Damage
(33) Blood Mandate - Accuracy
Level 35: Transference
(A) Accuracy IO
(36) Endurance Modification IO
(36) Endurance Modification IO
(36) Recharge Reduction IO
(37) Recharge Reduction IO
Level 38: Fulcrum Shift
(A) Accuracy IO
(39) Accuracy IO
(39) Recharge Reduction IO
(39) Recharge Reduction IO
(40) Recharge Reduction IO
Level 41: Fire Ball
(A) Positron's Blast - Chance of Damage(Energy)
(42) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(42) Positron's Blast - Damage/Recharge
(42) Positron's Blast - Damage/Endurance
(43) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage
Level 44: Fire Shield
(A) Impervium Armor - Resistance
(45) Impervium Armor - Resistance/Endurance
(45) Impervium Armor - Resistance/Recharge
(45) Impervium Armor - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge
Level 47: Fire Blast
(A) Decimation - Chance of Build Up
(48) Decimation - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(48) Decimation - Accuracy/Damage
(48) Decimation - Damage/Endurance
(50) Decimation - Damage/Recharge
Level 49: Recall Friend
(A) Recharge Reduction IO
------------
Level 1: Brawl
(A) Accuracy IO
Level 1: Sprint
(A) Run Speed IO
Level 2: Rest
(A) Recharge Reduction IO
Level 1: Containment
------------
Set Bonus Totals:
+3% Defense(Smashing)
+3% Defense(Lethal)
+3% Defense(Fire)
+3% Defense(Cold)
+3% Defense(Energy)
+3% Defense(Negative)
+6.75% Defense(Psionic)
+3% Defense(Melee)
+3% Defense(Ranged)
+6.13% Defense(AoE)
+11.3% Max Endurance
+43% Enhancement(Accuracy)
+4% Enhancement(Heal)
+48.8% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
+3% Enhancement(Stun)
+99.4 (8.25%) HitPoints
+Knockback (Mag -4)
+MezResist(Immobilize) (Mag 7.7%)
+MezResist(Terrorized) (Mag 2.2%)
+17% Recovery
+20% Regeneration
+4.41% Resistance(Fire)
+4.41% Resistance(Cold)
+3.13% Resistance(Negative)
+5% RunSpeed
------------
Set Bonuses:
Doctored Wounds
(Transfusion)
+MezResist(Terrorized) (Mag 2.2%)
+1.26% Res(Fire, Cold)
+4% Enhancement(Heal)
+5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Positron's Blast
(Fire Cages)
+2.5% Recovery
+1.575% Res(Fire, Cold)
+9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
+6.25% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Decimation
(Ring of Fire)
+MezResist(Immobilize) (Mag 2.75%)
+13.6 (1.13%) HitPoints
+2.25% Max Max Endurance
+6.25% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Scirocco's Dervish
(Hot Feet)
+10% Regeneration
+3.13% Resistance(Negative)
+9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
+3.13% Defense(AoE)
Stupefy
(Flashfire)
+2.5% Recovery
+22.6 (1.88%) HitPoints
+3% Enhancement(Stun)
+6.25% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Ghost Widow's Embrace
(Cinders)
+5% RunSpeed
+22.6 (1.88%) HitPoints
+2.25% Max Max Endurance
Crushing Impact
(Boxing)
+MezResist(Immobilize) (Mag 2.2%)
+13.6 (1.13%) HitPoints
+7% Enhancement(Accuracy)
+5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Steadfast Protection
(Tough)
+1.5% Recovery
+3% Def(All)
+Knockback (Mag -4)
Impervium Armor
(Tough)
+2.5% Recovery
+1.88% Defense(Psionic)
+2.25% Max Max Endurance
Kismet
(Weave)
+1.5% Recovery
Luck of the Gambler
(Weave)
+10% Regeneration
+13.6 (1.13%) HitPoints
+9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
+7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Blood Mandate
(Fire Imps)
+1.5% Recovery
Positron's Blast
(Fire Ball)
+2.5% Recovery
+1.575% Res(Fire, Cold)
+9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
+6.25% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Impervium Armor
(Fire Shield)
+2.5% Recovery
+1.88% Defense(Psionic)
+2.25% Max Max Endurance
Decimation
(Fire Blast)
+MezResist(Immobilize) (Mag 2.75%)
+13.6 (1.13%) HitPoints
+2.25% Max Max Endurance
+6.25% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
| Copy & Paste this data chunk into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build |
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:31OFFS8M4!&_!/:^YI<+R[#TYJ[X/C_3V='&D:JF9[H5^DIC<=?HVIYFG_1^@.@Y4R:/Y`D3?#(
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This build is set to maximize global recharge and accuracy, with a strong focus on picking up +end and +recov to help deal with the heavy toggles. Believe me, you will need Stamina as well as Transference to help deal with Endurance Issues. Spamming AoEs with heavy costed toggles on will rapidly drain you. When I don't have my backup Emp spamming AB/RAs I use Transference every mob, even though with all my endurance and recovery I can generally go through 2-3 mobs without needing the endurance boost.
One other thing to note with this build. It's designed to be capable of doing significant single target damage, with Ring of Fire and Fire Blast, as well as Char, doing damage. I found with my previous build that while I could take down entire mobs rapidly, I was slow as hell to take down any single target, because I only had AoE abilities and Fulcrum Shift doesn't do much for you with only one target. I was next to useless against AVs! This really hurt my performance on TFs, especially the STF, so I respeced into the above build to give me more Single Target damage ability. One of the perks of that change is that I can now farm Family maps with Bosses on them, as long as I have an Emp or some such giving me a Clear Mind type power to resist the controls of the Capo's and Consigliere's.
Anyway, this is definitely a build to respec into, as leveling this up would be pretty difficult, if not impossible for all but the most dedicated and patient players. GL with your Fire/Kin, because they are just outright awesome when built and played right.
W.P.
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| 02/19/08 15:06 |
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BigChill
Posts: 54
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Stay outta it, but I hit it on the spot? Now ain't that a contradiction...
Big Chill is a conscranker: he conrols a mob so they do nothing, scraps a target till they can't stand, and tanks what's left till the job's done.
Dive in, have fun, and think about it later.
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| 02/19/08 15:21 |
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DocterPink
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Wow, thanks a lot for the tips and hints here. I have a bunch of ideas in my head that could be put into play. Now I'm gonna throw in a build that I made that uses IOs including the super rares which I figure I can afford after a buncha runs. Here goes:
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.30
http://www.honourableunited.org.uk/mhd.php
My PL guy: Level 50 Mutation Controller
Primary Power Set: Fire Control
Secondary Power Set: Kinetics
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Stone Mastery
Hero Profile:
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Level 1: Char Hold-I:40(A), Hold-I:40(3), Acc-I:40(7), RechRdx-I:40(17), Dmg-I:40(46)
Level 1: Transfusion Heal-I:40(A), Heal-I:40(5), Heal-I:40(15), Acc-I:40(17), Acc-I:40(31), RechRdx-I:40(48)
Level 2: Fire Cages GravAnch-Hold%:50(A), GravAnch-Immob/EndRdx:50(3), GravAnch-Acc/Immob/Rchg:50(15), GravAnch-Immob/Rchg:50(29), GravAnch-Acc/Rchg:50(34)
Level 4: Siphon Power RechRdx-I:40(A), RechRdx-I:40(5), RechRdx-I:40(7), Acc-I:40(31), Acc-I:40(46)
Level 6: Combat Jumping LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx:39(A), LkGmblr-Def:39(43), Ksmt-ToHit+:30(43)
Level 8: Hot Feet EndRdx-I:50(A), EndRdx-I:50(9), EndRdx-I:50(9), Dmg-I:50(37), Dmg-I:40(40)
Level 10: Siphon Speed Acc-I:40(A), Acc-I:40(11), RechRdx-I:40(11), RechRdx-I:40(31)
Level 12: Flashfire Amaze-Stun:50(A), Amaze-Stun/Rchg:50(13), Amaze-Acc/Stun/Rchg:50(13), Amaze-Acc/Rchg:50(40)
Level 14: Super Jump Jump-I:40(A)
Level 16: Swift Run-I:40(A)
Level 18: Cinders UbrkCons-Hold:50(A), UbrkCons-Hold/Rchg:50(19), UbrkCons-Acc/Hold/Rchg:50(19), UbrkCons-Dam%:50(29), UbrkCons-Acc/Rchg:50(43)
Level 20: Health Heal-I:40(A), Numna-Heal:40(21), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+:39(21)
Level 22: Stamina EndMod-I:40(A), EndMod-I:40(23), EndMod-I:40(23)
Level 24: Hasten RechRdx-I:40(A), RechRdx-I:40(25), RechRdx-I:40(25)
Level 26: Smoke ToHitDeb-I:40(A), ToHitDeb-I:40(27), ToHitDeb-I:40(27)
Level 28: Speed Boost EndMod-I:40(A)
Level 30: Acrobatics EndRdx-I:40(A)
Level 32: Fire Imps S'bndAl-Dmg:50(A), S'bndAl-Dmg/Rchg:50(33), S'bndAl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(33), S'bndAl-Acc/Rchg:50(33), S'bndAl-Dmg/EndRdx:50(34), S'bndAl-Build%:50(34)
Level 35: Transference Efficacy-EndMod:40(A), Efficacy-EndMod/Rchg:40(36), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc/Rchg:40(36), Efficacy-Acc/Rchg:40(36), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc:40(37), RechRdx-I:40(37)
Level 38: Fulcrum Shift Acc-I:40(A), Acc-I:40(39), RechRdx-I:40(39), RechRdx-I:40(39), RechRdx-I:40(40)
Level 41: Hurl Boulder Apoc-Dmg/EndRdx:50(A), Apoc-Dmg/Rchg:50(42), Apoc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(42), Apoc-Acc/Rchg:50(42)
Level 44: Fissure Ragnrk-Dmg:50(A), Ragnrk-Dmg/Rchg:50(45), Ragnrk-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(45), Ragnrk-Acc/Rchg:50(45), Dsrnt-I:40(46)
Level 47: Rock Armor LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx:39(A), LkGmblr-Def:39(48), LkGmblr-Rchg+:40(48)
Level 49: Earth's Embrace Numna-Heal:40(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg:40(50), RechRdx-I:40(50), RechRdx-I:40(50)
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Level 1: Brawl Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint EndRdx-I:40(A)
Level 2: Rest RechRdx-I:40(A)
Level 1: Containment
------------
Set Bonus Totals:
+10.5% DamageBuff
+5% Defense(Psionic)
+60% Enhancement(Accuracy)
+27.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
+99.4 (8.25%) HitPoints
+MezResist(Held) (Mag 4.4%)
+17.5% Recovery
+86% Regeneration
+10.1% Resistance(Fire)
+10.1% Resistance(Cold)
There it is. Now Big helped me confirm what I thought: Smoke isn't for the -perception, its for the accuracy debuff. Sure it's small, but mixing it with the defense from CJ and Rock Armor should make me pretty tough to hit. With Hurl Boulder, I think I can do plenty of single target damage especially with containment. Also, I've seen Fire/Kins die before and I'd like to avoid that so EE and the extra defense is nice. The set bonuses are also pretty nice. Lots of damage, accuracy, recharge, HP, recovery and regen bonuses. The 10% resistance should also be nice if I run Council. All in all, I really appreciate the build advice and I think this build isn't half bad. Any comments on it?
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| 02/19/08 16:15 |
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Lightfoot27
Posts: 1
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Build looks good. I'd definitely recommend dropping hurl boulder though. With the animation time and lack of range, it really becomes useless as they'll be dead before it lands. Good dmg, but not an efficient source of dmg. I'd recommend picking up tp friend if PL'ing is what you're going for. Other than that, great build.
BEST TEST ANSWERS EVER!
"Who was responsible for inventing the cotton gin?"
"I'm unable to divulge that information as it may compromise our agents in the field."
"What was the date of Columbus' journey to the americas?"
"I do not believe in linear time, the past and future are one, existence in the temporal sense is illusionary... this question is therefore meaningless and impossible to answer."
-Calvin and Hobbes
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| 02/19/08 17:13 |
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BigChill
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Heh, that's a fairly solid build there. It'll do well for that PL you want, but may also be quite useful in many other situations, to say nothing of the shock factor when ppl notice its a fire/kin hurling that boulder. Not exactly the fastest addition, but its dmg with containment will make it hurt. Keep it if you want, I like it.
Big Chill is a conscranker: he conrols a mob so they do nothing, scraps a target till they can't stand, and tanks what's left till the job's done.
Dive in, have fun, and think about it later.
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| 02/19/08 20:14 |
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Warron Peace
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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| QUOTE | | Stay outta it, but I hit it on the spot? Now ain't that a contradiction... |
Except you didn't hit it right on the spot. You suggested Ice Mastery first, which is probably the worst for a fast moving farmer. Then you suggest Stone Mastery, which does have its merits, but is not nearly as good as Fire Mastery. The benefit from EE is far less on a controller, as they have a lower HP cap than Tankers/Scrappers/Brutes. At capped HP they only have about 1600 HP, less than a scrappers base HP at level 50.
Then you suggest Maneuvers for its defense value. 2.6% base defense for a controller. The equivalent of 5% resistance. Useless. Stack it with Stone Armor for a total S/L defense of 17%, at base. With Weave, you have 4.5% base defense. Thats right, nearly twice as much. For 20% less endurance per second, no less. Stack Weave with Stone Armor and you have 18.9% base S/L defense. Yay, thats more! Then add in Tough to go with Weave, and you not only have 18.9% base defense, you also have 15% base S/L resistance. An equivalent to 53% resistance to S/L damage. Much better than just having Manuevers and no Tough.
I can understand taking Maneuvers to open up Tactics, so that you have more tohit. But with global accuracy bonuses so easily gotten from sets, you don't need Tactics. Imps aren't a major part of your damage output, so they don't need the extra Tohit. Assault? You are already capping your damage with Fulcrum Shift on every mob, you don't need the paltry buff from Assault. No, for a Fire/Kin farming build, Leadership toggles are just an endurance expensive waste of your time. You are much better off getting Tough and Weave. It's not a waste of a power to take Boxing/Kick, as they can add to single target DPS, as well as make a nice outlet for the Crushing Impact set, not to mention Hecatomb (purple melee set).
Now, lets get to the best farming Fire/Kin Epic, Fire Mastery. 27.5% base resistance in Fire Shield. A little less when compared to equivalent resistance of Rock Armor, but it makes up for it with 20% resistance to Fire damage, vital if you plan on farming the Demon map, ever. Add in Tough, and you have 42.5% resistance to S/L, at base values. Add in Weave's equivalent base 9% resistance, and you have 41.5% resistance. A little less than the Stone Mastery setup, but more than your Stone + Leadership build. Plus, it has 20% base resistance to fire damage, again, vital if you plan on ever farming Demons.
Quick note about Smoke. It has a 90% -perception value. This means basically that if you aren't standing toe to toe with them, they don't see you. On the Family and Demon Farm maps, mobs are often very close together, so close that as you assault one mob, another aggros from seeing you. This is where smoke comes in handy, as it buys you time to finish one mob before taking on the next mob. It's -tohit is at base 5%. Not a whole lot of protection there, even with stacking defense numbers. Use Smoke to prevent extra aggro, not protect you from taking damage. Trust me on this.
Now to go into the realm of defense versus resistance. Which is better? To be totally honest, it depends on the archetype, because it really depends on how much HP you have to spare. Defense is in theory the best, because you hopefully avoid all the incoming damage and take none. With High HP archetypes, defense works fine, because they have a sizeable chunk of HP to cut into if defense fails. With lower HP ATs, this isn't the case. For a lower HP archetype, resistance is more valuable because it's reliable. You will always take less incoming damage with resistance. Resistance will always give you more time to heal back damage taken. Defense based sets, such as Ice Armor, Stone Armor, and Super Reflexes work just fine for Scrappers and Tanks because their base HP is higher than the caps for Controllers, Defenders, and Blasters. For the lower HP crowd, resistance is infinitely better, because they don't have anywhere near as much HP to buffer attacks that get by your defenses.
So, because it's resistance based, and because it gets fire resistance, Fire Mastery is best for a Farming Fire/Kin. Thats without even going into the fact that it has the Ultimate AoE damage attack, Fireball. Quick enough recharge, especially with Hasten and multiple Siphon Speeds, to be used on every mob, it, when combined with capped damage and containment, will basically kill all the minions in a mob, and take a large chunk of the 3-4 LTs HP with it. Then add in Fire Blast to take them out, as well as Ring of Fire and Boxing/Kick (I love punching things to death =D). Good, clean, fast attacks that do great damage. If you want to take consume, you get yet another AoE damage ability, that happens to help with endurance issues, to boot. Believe me, to a Farming Fire/Kin, endurance is your life blood. You need end to fire off the AoEs that kill things. You need endurance to run all the toggles that keep you alive. You need endurance to fire off the awesome heal you have, to keep you alive through the damage you are taking. Any extra source of endurance is more than welcome, especially before you get alot of +recov and +end set bonuses flowing. My Fire/Kin is so well IOd out that I don't have need of Consume. Others may want it, and are more than welcome to take it. I'd put it in Fire Blast's place, so that it can get appropriate slotting to be functional.
Anyway, Big Chill, until you get a fire/kin to 50 and start farming regularly, for hours on end, with him/her, don't try to comment on the build. I know what I'm talking about from over 500 hours of farming with my 50 fire/kin, as well as extensive testing of various builds. I have a good many friends who have Fire/Kins, both players that I convinced to level the build, and players that have helped me along the way with learning all there is to know about the build and its powers. Catch up with me before you start calling me out.
W.P.
PS: To anyone out there who wants to see a well built, well played Fire/Kin in action, please feel free to PM me, or contact me in-game @Warron Peace or @Nasazi Peace. Mine is on Virtue, and I'd be more than willing to take anyone through a trial run, complete with advice from one of the experts, myself. Hell, I may even be able to get other experienced farmers to join in for a run to help confirm what I've said here. So get a hold of me!
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| 02/19/08 20:50 |
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BigChill
Posts: 54
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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What the Hell is it with you? I gave a basic suggestion, included what is the best idea, and you still have a problem with it...
First off, I got the basics, hit the general idea, and did this with the intention of SOs cause IOs are expensive.
I gave fire first. I'm not assuming they are stupid, but I explained why Ice and Earth has its perks. The basic build uses Fire, sorry its not IO'd out first, I figured they can get the plan better off later when they've used it.
The best farmer never takes damage. If you only think of smoking one mob at a time, might as well do it the old way.
Anyone could guess why fire is better with me including how this uses AoEs for dmg. I only gave these other options because they are options. Just because I don;t advertise for killing a game with grinding repetition doesn't mean I haven't done it.
IOs aside, and short of inf, I gave this suggestion for something anyone could afford. That was all I was doing. If you have a problem with the poor people that don't have the inf to afford the best, too bad. I'm not going to stop suggesting this just because better is out there, along with its price.
Oh, and sorry, though you knew the pinprick of the inf farmers association was in the spot of people that can grasp how this build works.
Big Chill is a conscranker: he conrols a mob so they do nothing, scraps a target till they can't stand, and tanks what's left till the job's done.
Dive in, have fun, and think about it later.
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| 02/19/08 21:30 |
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Rainah
GameAmp Staff
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Hey yal both have great advice and lets keep this on topic not a I am better than you on this fight...everyone has opinions and they are all going to be viewed differently...
Doctor Pink
I wish you all the luck in building your character .. Let us know how it turns out
You can chat with me on AIM.. I am Stormtanker
email me at stormtanker@aol.com
On myspace.com/vixen_samm
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| 02/20/08 05:29 |
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DocterPink
Posts: 4
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Well thank you Rainah :) As for Warron, wow that was a long read. I never looked at Res and Def that way and it makes sense I guess but who farms on a 'Demon map'? I'm planning on either Council or Family, Freakshow if I can get some mez protection. Fire resistance is a small added bonus
Also, Tremor from Stone Mastery is an AMAZING power in PL'ing. I have a friend who makes the claim that he didn't take Cinders or Flashfire and simply uses the stun on Tremor. As out there as that is, an extra AoE stun along with AoE damage? Oh yeah. That and the Dull Pain were the main reasons I wanted the set. Does Hurl Boulder's animation really make it undesirable? Seems like it could easily do great damage on a lit if I had FS and containment on...
And once again, thank you Warran. Never thought about Leadership in the sense of the size of the bonuses. So Leadership's out...
Now theres Lightfoot's suggestion about TP instead of smoke. I was just about to do it will Warren mentioned it could save my butt on Family maps which I could end up farming. So now I need to know, since it's accuracy debuff is aparently useless, should I go for the friendly Fire/Kin that can bring you right to the door or the safe fire/kin that doesn't die due to extra aggro?
I really, really appreciate the input and it's helping me a whole lot but I still don't have a firm footing on this whole PL thing. There are so many things to be worried about that I'm afraid I'll miss one of em and make either a slow, weak, unaccurate, or squishy toon >.<
PS: Big, Warron, you are both really helpful. No need to have a little tiff. Now kiss and make up :P
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| 02/20/08 05:56 |
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Phase_of_Echoes
GameAmp Staff
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Doc, there is some really good advice given in this thread. I believe you can use any or all of it and be successful.
Guys, lets find a way to help someone without picking at each other. Its good to have diffrent opinons because it opens up a topic of conversation and allows everyone to see diffrent points of view. We are here to help and learn from each other. Agree to disagree. Thats ok. Everyone is entitled to their say on any subject that is posted on the Forums, but lets remember what kind of example we are setting. If the COH Gameamp site is the best COH site on the internet, we want to be viewed as informative and helpful players. Talk it out in PMs, or whatever communication devices you want, but lets not do it where the community has to dig through it to find information.
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| 02/20/08 07:14 |
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RonJ73
GameAmp Staff
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Consider this a warning to both of you, stop the bickering or I start with the ban-stick. I'm sick and tired of all the infighting on this site. It seems like anytime there's a difference of opinion, the two of you need to start argueing about it. That's NOT what this site is about and you know it.
This will be your final warning and will be PMed to both of you.
Thread locked.
City of Heroes/Villains
Onion - L50 - Katana/Super Reflexes/Body Mastery Scrapper
Scotch Bonnet Girl - L50 - Fire Aura/Fire Melee/Pyre Mastery Tanker
Aurora Australis - L41 - Willpower/Energy Melee Tanker
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| 02/20/08 08:09 |
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Grifter0408
GameAmp Staff
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Everything Ron said I fully agree with and stand by.
I am allowing the thread to be re-open so that DP can get some further help, questions, ideas, or whatever needed for the build. I want this kept on topic and if this thread gets back out of handed, further actions will be taken by the staff.
Gameamp is a community that wants and expects varying viewpoints and doesnt mind to have conflicting discussion but in a civil manner, a respectful manner. The post above were conducted in a way that was nothing less than childish.
It should be expected that there are many different ideas, views, methods, and outcomes. You may not fully agree with them but you should respect that other persons and what they brought to the table. There are, at times, many different resolutions to a problem. If you cant except that there are other ways then your own then you shouldn't be posting on a forum. We all dont talk, walk, act, or think the same way. Thats why we are unique and interesting.
Please resume the discussion. And honestly if I can throw something out.
Ditch the whole controller build and just go with something that is way better...Scrapper.
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| 02/20/08 14:19 |
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Death_Conqueror
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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| QUOTE | Well thank you Rainah :) As for Warron, wow that was a long read. I never looked at Res and Def that way and it makes sense I guess but who farms on a 'Demon map'? I'm planning on either Council or Family, Freakshow if I can get some mez protection. Fire resistance is a small added bonus
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The reason one would tend to shoot more towards the demon map in today's game is b/c of the magic drops that the demons will throw out. Council/Family/Freaks, while easier to eliminate, only drop the tech salvage. So, it depends on what kind of PL-ing you're after.
Do you want the pure leveling speed? Just in it for "getting this guy up there real fast"? In that case, go for the council/family/freaks. First mission I can think of would be I think the 3rd or 4th in Unai's story arc. Steel Canyon outdoor map, 12 portals to click to end map, full of family.
If, however, you want the PL + assorted money goodness, go for the demon maps. You would have to contend with the demons activating their version of invincibility, which can make them not necessarily harder to defeat, just more annoying. Going this way gives you a shot at the good salvage, such as pangean soils, hami goos, prophecy, magical conspiracy, etc. There's one I can think of, I want to say it's in Harvey Naylor's story arc (the 45-50 carnie arc). Not sure what mission it is, but it's another Steel Canyon outdoor map, just full of behemoths, iirc.
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| 02/20/08 14:30 |
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DocterPink
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Ooh, wow. Totally never heard about PL's + Salvage Drop runs. Thanks Death (kind of an odd sentence to say really...). I guess stating my main goal of what I'm trying to do isn't a bad idea at all. I want to give my PL'ers a relatively fast run with the most XP possible.
The most XP in a run I ever got was from a Freak map because they ressurect and you can kill em again. However, they have a lot of stuns and sleeps making it slightly more difficult. Because of that, I think Psionic Mastery could work. Comes with resistance, mez guard and 2 kinds of ranged blast.
The next option is Family which I've had little experience running with. I know they mostly do Smash and Lethal with some control effects from the bosses. The little experience I've had with the PI Family farm was that it was the fastest PL I ever had. While they techinically allows me to make the most money (charging people per run) that seems kind of mean. I'm a terrible buisnessman, I just wanna give everyone free xp :)
Lastly is the oh-so-classic Council mission. I didn't know it came from Unai but I know plenty about it. Seen it like a thousand times. Mostly Smash, Lethal, Knockback and Fire. All of these things Leaping and Fire Mastery cover. So I could do this but I dunno...just seems boring. I'm pretty sure I'm the only person who cares what kind of mission they run but whatever.
So yeah. I'm almost ready to try and get my guy a respec and get him to get his epic set (you guys advice has helped TONS!!) but I need a few more things answered:
Should I do Freaks or Council?
If I do Freaks, should I pick up Psionic?
Should I consider this whole "Salvage and XP" thing and maybe get Fire Mastery and do Demon farming?
I'm going to try and be the nicest PL'er and PL any old person as long as they bring their own bridge. Is this a good idea or should I charge folks?
So yeah, if someone could help we with those last few things, then in a little while infinity would have a new Fire/Kin. Once again, Thanks a million for the advice and help!
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| 02/20/08 15:23 |
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Solarix
Posts: 32
Joined: 08/13/2006
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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| QUOTE | | the Psi's tornado is nice, but its that KB that you'll hate. |
just a little thing, if i remember correctly, the tornado is knockup, and it hits minions almost always and lieuts most of the time, but never really hits bosses. It might be worth considering if you want the extra loss of footing, and its nearly unresisted damage. Someone else will know, but i think its a good power that does decent damage, just not quite as much as fissure or fireball.
My DeviantART (the comic is going up, page-by-page about once a day!)
City of Heroes
Global Name: @Lethal Dose
Virtue
Lady Arya - lvl 50!! D3 defender(main)
Luna Moonlink - lvl 27 Peacebringer
Mr Galactic - lvl 20 Fire/Fire Blaster
Ethereal Phoenix - lvling Fire/Kin Controller
Aurelei - lvl 26 Warshade
Zhaan - lvl 18 Storm/Sonic Defender
Amazing Alice - lvl 21 Dark/WP Scrapper
Clara Wink - lvl 28 claws/regen scrapper
Imamu - lvl 24 sonic/ice blaster
and various others...
Freedom
La Psypathe - lvl 34 FF/Psy Defender
True Psight - lvl 28 illusions/empathy controller
Plus, I play Guild Wars.
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| 02/20/08 17:52 |
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Warron Peace
Posts: 0
Joined: 06/06/2006
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Ok, first off I want to apologize to anyone who was offended by my previous statements. That was by far not my intention, to offend anyone, I mean. My sole goal in posting in peoples threads when they ask about powers or build advice is to get the most valid and accurate information across, both from my personal experience and knowledge, and from the experience and knowledge of my friends and any other people who have posted both here and on the official boards. If I don't know everything about a power, I'll do my best to help out, but I always try to get it across to any recipients of my knowledge that I may not be 100% correct.
That said, I do have alot of basic experience with just about every powerset in the game. I've played every single archetype in the game to level 20 at least, although not with every powerset, of course. Some powersets frankly don't interest me, so when a question comes up about them, I generally don't add my imput, as it'd be too limited to be of value. However, there are a good many powersets that I do know alot about, having played them personally, or knowing others who have played them and shared their knowledge of them with me. Suffice to say that I know alot about this game, and that I'm always willing to share my knowledge and experience with others. If anything I ever say comes across as being the "one and only way to do things" then I deeply and humbly apologize. Everyone is entitled to play how they want, with whatever powers they choose, and far be it of me to deny them their fun. Just the other day the tank I was teamed with on my scrapper said we need a healer. As I was the team leader, I immediately looked for a defender. The defender that ended up joining us was TA/A and did a wonderful job of mitigating the damage and debuffs from our enemies that we found we didn't need green numbers flying over our heads. That is the way I play, not limiting anyone to any powersets, or saying that any set is better than any other, except for specific individual circumstances, in which one set may shine more than others.
Anyway, like I said, I'm sorry if I came across as some sort of dictator. That's by far the wrong impression I meant to make. I just hope that those I offended can forgive me, and that the innocent bystanders can overlook my seeming downfall. =D
Now, about Fire/Kin. Let me first say that I have over 500 hours clocked farming with my Fire/Kin. This is time that I've spent PLing other players, be it for free or for a per-level fee, depending on how well I knew the person. (I've never charged an amper a single influence for a PL, just FYI.) I've used both Stone Mastery and Fire Mastery extensively, so most of my experience is with those two sets. I've seen Psi Mastery used by many Fire/Kins, and used successfully, I may add, so you could say I have a moderate amount of second-hand experience with that set, as well. I'll say this now, so that everyone understands it up front. There is no wrong build, at least in theory, for farming. Some will be more successful than others, but all of them can do it in some way, shape, or form. What I'm trying to convey is my experiences with Fire/Kin, and what I have found to work best for me and others I know. You do not have to follow my advice in order to farm. However, you may find that my advice is good to follow, because it comes from alot of practice and experience farming. I farm on Virtue, and by many I'm considered one of the best, and fastest, farmers on that server. I'm not trying to gloat, just to show you that I do know what I'm talking about when it comes to farming with a Fire/Kin.
Doc, my advice to you is to farm Family mobs. Outside of the bosses, they have very little mezz capabilities. They can occasionally get a stun from their punches, but that is easily mitigated by the fact that the Imps will be bouncing around drawing aggro this way and that, so you aren't necessarily doomed to die as soon as you are stunned. This is especially true when you start getting set bonuses increasing your Base HP and base Regen rate. Essentially, you become tough enough that a few seconds spent stunned won't be enough to kill you, and that you'll be able to come out of the stun with enough life left to regain control of the situation. The only other "mezz" they have is knockdown from the buckshots. I have one KB IO slotted into Tough, and for all the hours I've spent farming, I can count the number of times I've been knocked down on one hand. It just doesn't happen that often, nor does it really affect you when it does. If you invest in Acrobatics from the Leaping pool, you'll likely never get knocked down, but I found that unnecessary once I slotted a KB IO.
The Family farm map (Steel Canyon, twin rows of streets with varying cross streets) is ideal for farming, as the mobs are rather close together, so you can get from one to the next with a minimum of downtime. The Council map is more spread out, with the mobs further apart, resulting in more downtime in between mobs. If you prefer Council for concept reasons, or just like the idea of beating on them more, then by all means farm them. I advise against it, however, as it *will* be slower farming than the basic Family map.
I advise against farming Freaks, simply because not only do they have more wide spread mezzes, they also have more HP per baddie when compared to Family and Council. They literally need to take more damage to die, which can seriously slow you down. Now, they do rezz individually, and that does result in more xp, but goes against basic farming/PLing theory. It's not the amount of XP you are getting per run, but how fast the XP is coming in. It may take two runs on the Family map to get a person the same amount of XP gotten from one run on the Freak map, but I guarantee I can do more than two runs on the Family map in the time it takes to do one run on the Freak map. I've tested this out many times with various Fire/Kin builds, using Herostats to calculate XP/Hour ratios. The Family map, in my experience, yeilds the greatest XP/Hour compared to the other maps. This is because the mobs are easiest to kill, do the least amount of mezzing, and are packed closely together, making for quick annihilation of each mob with very little downtime in between mobs.
Now, if you are really worried about mezzes, then I advise going for Psi Mastery. Indomitable Will is pretty easy to get to either Perma or near Perma levels, and will give you more than adequate mezz protection. Psi Tornado does do knockup, but IIRC, Fire Cages negates knocks on any immobilized target, so the KU from the Tornado may as well be a moot point. I am not 100% sure on this, as I haven't actually used Psi Mastery myself, and I don't know for sure if Fire Cages actually does eliminate the Knockup of the Tornado. That may be something you should consider testing before commiting to the set, as you may find that you don't like the Knockup if it isn't prevented, or you may find that it doesn't affect your farming one way or the other. Also, Psi Mastery's toggle, Mind Over Body, does offer resistance to Psi damage, so you may find that of value if you face alot of Psi damage in your non-farming play. Psi Mastery is a very capable set to take for Farming, its just a matter of what you want from your epic set.
Now, the bare bones of Stone Mastery versus Fire Mastery. If *all* you plan on ever doing is farming Family mobs, then you may find you like Stone Mastery more. Rock Armor combined with Weave will have you avoiding alot of incoming damage, and Fissure really is a nice little AoE attack with good DPS and good secondary mitigation. It's range from you is irrelevant, as you will generally always be in melee range anyway. Earth's Embrace is not necessary, but if you are really insecure about your HP, and want the extra heal plus the perks of capped HP, then it will serve you well. I'd advise against Hurl Boulder, as its activation time really does run counter to the spirit of farming. But again, it's all a matter of what you want from your Epic set.
Now, if you ever plan on farming the Demon map, then I strongly advise you take Fire Mastery. The fire resistance, once enhanced, will be nearly 30%, and can be invaluable in keeping you alive. You will do less damage to them, because they resist your fire damage, but you will also have the time needed to do the damage because you will heavily resist their damage. Outside of the demon map, I still strongly suggest Fire Mastery, for the simple fact that on lower HP characters, the reliability of Resistance based protection really is more valuable than the avoidance of damage that Defense can offer. Defense can keep all damage off of you, but it can also fail and cause you take all the incoming damage, which you literally don't have the HP to survive. Resistance means you will always take X% less damage, and will never fail you, but you will often have to heal your self, generally once or twice per mob, depending on your IO setup.
One other perk of Stone Armor, even though I'm against it, is that the stuns coming from the punches and kicks of the Family mobs are far less likely to hit, as they won't hit you as much. If you go with Rock Armor, you really won't have to worry about being stunned from out of nowhere.
Anyway, I hope this rather lengthy post has helped you to decide on what epic to take, as well as what maps to farm/PL with.
As far as charging people, don't feel bad about it. You are performing a service for them, and as such should be compensated for it. I wouldn't ever charge a person Influence or anything else for bridging, as they are helping you to do your job, and shouldn't have to pay to help. I also don't charge my friends for a PL, unless its inopportune for me to be doing it. Very commonly I trade farming for farming, PLing someones alt in return for them PLing my alts. Or, if I don't plan on PLing them, or they don't have any alts that they want PLed at the time, I'll compensate them for farming for me by paying them what I would charge for the same PL for a stranger. It's just common courtesy to be fair to others, and more often than not they will be fair to you, offering to pay you even though you don't plan on charging them. Sometimes I'll accept that payment, if I could really use the funds, other times I'll decline, because I don't need the funds or really don't want them paying me. =D
Geez, I don't know what else to say, other than feel free to contact me via PM or this thread, or In-Game @Warron Peace or @Nasazi Peace if you have any questions at all. I have a wealth of knowledge that I am more than willing to share with anyone and everyone who asks.
Again, I'm also willing to give anyone a "guided tour" of sorts, taking them on a couple of runs with my Fire/Kin, so that they can see and learn what the build is capable of. I'm on Virtue, just get a hold of me somehow and I'd be glad to arrange a run or two.
W.P.
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| 02/20/08 20:20 |
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Cr3ss3nt
GameAmp Staff
Posts: 11
Joined: 08/04/2006
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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| QUOTE | And honestly if I can throw something out.
Ditch the whole controller build and just go with something that is way better...Scrapper. |
Haha grff you never fail to make me laugh.... =D
On discussion, I don't have build suggestions, nor do I promote power leveling, but good luck anyways. =]
Cr3
Super Smash Bros. Brawl Code: 4468-0698-2171
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Brawl: Snake / Guitar Hero III: Johnny Napalm + Jimi Hendrix Flying V
Damn, no box.
CoX Global: @Cr3ss3nt1
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***THIS POST HAS BEEN CR3SSIFIED***
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| 02/20/08 21:53 |
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DocterPink
Posts: 4
Joined: 12/22/2006
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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Wow Warren, that was one hell of a speech. And I'll be damned if it didn't help. I am now totally confident one the whole resistance thing. And now I can thankfully rule out the dreadfully boring Council map. Which is nice. Now as soon as you mentioned "XP/Hour" I was paying close attention. So Family works best? Aight, I'm cool for that. And I guess Fire Mastery isn't so bad (I got it on my main) it just seems too generic. I like being unique, and being a Fire/Kin is not unique at all.
So, Family with a Fire/Kin/Fire troller seems to be the best option. I will try Freaks however and probably even a Fire/Kin/Psi build idea I have just for the hell of it. See which one I like better.
Now for the charging thing. I suppose that works. Maybe it's the listing of the rates on the characters deion. Just seems so rigid and mean somehow. Maybe it's just me. But I guess if any ol' person wants a PL, I could ask for a little influ. Makes good buisness sense I guess seeing as how all my builds involve lots of IOs.
Well, I think thats it. All I gotta do is level this guy up and try out those 2 builds and maps. Thank you guys for the help. I really appreciate it
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| 02/21/08 18:31 |
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Warron Peace
Posts: 0
Joined: 06/06/2006
Credibility: 0 pts
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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NP Doc. Again, I'm sorry it all got so heated along the way. I'm glad we were able to help you, despite the childishness that happened in the process. =D
Good Luck with your Fire/Kin, and if you need any advice, you know how to reach me. =D
W.P.
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| 02/21/08 18:45 |
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robot mind
Posts: 1
Joined: 05/03/2007
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| RE: The Many Faces of a PL |
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yeah good luck doc.
I'm not a altoholic...no really i only have 1000+ toons...thats not..really...never mind.
Ninja Strike!!!
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| 02/21/08 21:28 |
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